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The "Aussie" Melbourne Cup - Melbourne Cup - Racehorse TALK

Author Topic: The "Aussie" Melbourne Cup  (Read 30224 times)

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Offline PoisonPen7

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O.P. « 2012-Nov-07, 01:24 AM »
This is hypothetical race where the participants are "Australian" horses.

There is a bit of debate about what constitutes an "Aussie" horse.

i) We don't accept horses where the connections are rich enough to just go overseas and simply buy raced stock - not egalitarian enough to be classified as "Aussie".

ii) No New Zealanders as well. Not until they become the seventh state.

iii) It is OK if the horse is bred overseas as long as it has done all (or nearly all) of it's racing here. Otherwise we would have some years where we wouldn't get a quorum.

Year 1st 2nd 3rd Notes
2014 Signoff Precedence Fawkner
2013 Fawkner Ethiopia Super Cool
2012 Precedence Niwot Lights Of Heaven
2011 Niwot Precedence The Verminator
2010 Maluckyday So You Think Zipping
2009 Shocking Master O'Reilly Alcopop
2008 Viewed Master O'Reilly Moatize
2007 Efficient Zipping Dolphin Jo
2006 Maybe Better Zipping Mahtoum
2005 Makybe Diva On A Jeune Leica Falcon
2004 Makybe Diva Zazzman Elvestroem
2003 Makybe Diva She's Archie Pentastic
2002 Mr Prudent Pentastic Rain Gauge
2001 Karasi Rain Gauge Sky Heights
2000 Brew Yippyio Freemason
1999 Rogan Josh Lahar (DH) Zazabelle (DH) (DH 2nd)
1998 Tie The Knot Skybeau Perpetual Check
1997 Might And Power Doriemus Markham
1996 Saintly Count Chivas Skybeau
1995 Doriemus Nothin' Leica Dane Coachwood
1994 Paris Lane Oompala Alcove

And their off!
« Last Edit: 2014-Nov-04, 11:43 PM by PoisonPen7 »

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2012-Nov-07, 01:27 AM Reply #1 »
Amazingly, we got the same quinella as last year!

1st Precedence
2nd Niwot
3rd Lights Of Heaven

So Precedence goes into the Hall Of Fame/Shame. Another Cup for Bart.  :no1:

Year 1st 2nd 3rd
2012 Precedence Niwot Lights Of Heaven
2011 Niwot Precedence The Verminator
2010 Maluckyday So You Think Zipping
2009 Shocking Master O'Reilly Alcopop
2008 Viewed Master O'Reilly Moatize
2007 Efficient Zipping Dolphin Jo
2006 Maybe Better Zipping Mahtoum
2005 Makybe Diva On A Jeune Leica Falcon
2004 Makybe Diva Zazzman Elvestroem
2003 Makybe Diva She's Archie Pentastic
2002 Mr Prudent Pentastic Rain Gauge
2001 Karasi Rain Gauge Sky Heights
2000 Brew Yippyio Freemason
1999 Rogan Josh Lahar (DH) Zazabelle (DH) (DH 2nd)
1998 Tie The Knot Skybeau Perpetual Check
1997 Might And Power Doriemus Markham
1996 Saintly Count Chivas Skybeau
1995 Doriemus Nothin' Leica Dane Quick Ransom
1994 Jeune Paris Lane Oompala
1993 Te Akau Nick Great Vintage Fronteir Boy

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2012-Nov-07, 01:32 AM Reply #2 »
And isn't this a great advertisement for the great Aussie stayer   emthup

Niwot won last year's Aussie Cup, went on to actually win the Sydney Cup and then runs 2nd in this year's Aussie. Surely he is the best Aussie stayer going around.

Only 7 out of the 18 starters in the Caulfield Cup this year were "Aussie" in another growing trend.

Offline Wenona

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« 2012-Nov-07, 07:18 AM Reply #3 »
And Niwot and Ethiopia were the only two runners actually bred in Australia weren't they?

Offline Authorized

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« 2012-Nov-07, 07:50 AM Reply #4 »
Jeune ?

Offline Mullerbeck

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« 2012-Nov-07, 08:54 AM Reply #5 »
Technically speaking, Makybe Diva was also bred in UK and brough to Australia as yearling. Not sure she really qualifies as being an Aussie.

Offline ianb

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« 2012-Nov-07, 09:44 AM Reply #6 »
 :tin:
Karasi?

I take it purchasing overseas tried horses though doesn't include NZ- Brew, Doriemus and Te Akau Nick all raced in N.Z. before being brought over to Australia.

Offline Authorized

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« 2012-Nov-07, 11:21 AM Reply #7 »
I think New Zealanders should be included as should Makybe Diva. In both cases they brought up and educated in the failing Australian manner.

Offline The Jackal

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« 2012-Nov-07, 06:14 PM Reply #8 »
I think New Zealanders should be included as should Makybe Diva. In both cases they brought up and educated in the failing Australian manner.

The failing Australian manner seemed to work okay for Efficient, Viewed and Shocking.
Incidentally Green Moon was given exactly the same preparation as stablemate Efficient, a 4 run build up going via the Memsie , Dato Tan Chin Nam , Turnbull  and Cox Plate.
In the past couple of weeks, connections have also mentioned that Efficient would give Green Moon a start and a beating over 2 miles.

One thing we do know is that UK training methods will not get them over the line in this race. 

Offline Jeunes

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« 2012-Nov-07, 06:41 PM Reply #9 »
Jeune ?

Don't insult the great horse.

He was "naturalised".   :lol:

Offline manikato1

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« 2012-Nov-07, 06:49 PM Reply #10 »
One thing we do know is that UK training methods will not get them over the line in this race. 

What a ridiculous statement.  2nd and arguably the run of the race this year, second last year.  A horse from OS will again win the Cup first up over here, their record is too good not to.

Offline Authorized

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« 2012-Nov-07, 07:00 PM Reply #11 »
The failing Australian manner seemed to work okay for Efficient, Viewed and Shocking.
Incidentally Green Moon was given exactly the same preparation as stablemate Efficient, a 4 run build up going via the Memsie , Dato Tan Chin Nam , Turnbull  and Cox Plate.
In the past couple of weeks, connections have also mentioned that Efficient would give Green Moon a start and a beating over 2 miles.

One thing we do know is that UK training methods will not get them over the line in this race. 

Jackal, what is the Aussie method between birth and the racetrack ?

This is where the Australian stayer is losing out.


Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2012-Nov-07, 07:23 PM Reply #12 »
Jeune ?

The "Aussie" Melbourne Cup has evolved over the years. Whereas today Jeune would be classified as an international blow-in, back in those days he was a rarity so we keep him as one of ours.


Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2012-Nov-07, 07:25 PM Reply #13 »
Technically speaking, Makybe Diva was also bred in UK and brough to Australia as yearling. Not sure she really qualifies as being an Aussie.

Aussie Muller.

She would have no memory of her time in the mother country, and never had any accent.

Offline bolt_babe

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« 2012-Nov-07, 08:48 PM Reply #14 »
Karasi was definitely a ring in too.. Did early racing in the UK

Offline Authorized

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« 2012-Nov-13, 05:04 AM Reply #15 »
I reckon this is the thread to keep track of promising Aussie and New Zealand bred and developed stayers on their way towards the Cup, bearing in mind they need a rating of 103/104 to get in the cup above and beyond the idea they need to qualify.

Offline Authorized

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« 2013-Oct-30, 08:35 PM Reply #16 »
Who will be left standing this year ?

Offline The Carnegie Express

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« 2013-Oct-30, 08:55 PM Reply #17 »
Fawkner

 


Offline vedder

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« 2013-Oct-30, 10:09 PM Reply #18 »
Hawkspur.... maybe? :what:

Offline The Carnegie Express

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« 2013-Oct-30, 10:17 PM Reply #19 »
Isn't he sired from us breeds?


Offline vedder

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« 2013-Oct-30, 10:27 PM Reply #20 »
Sire Purrealist is Aussie bred although sire is from the US (http://www.breednet.com.au/stallions/sire-data.asp?sire=Purrealist) and quite sure dam is Aussie bred. Horse was born in Australia.

To me, that's 'Aussie'! :thumbsup:

Offline Draven39

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« 2013-Oct-30, 10:56 PM Reply #21 »
Why are we even bothering with this anymore?

All the top trainers over here go with the Euro bred's to have a chance in the Cup. It used to be NZ where they looked to, now it's Europe. Even if they are foaled here, you look at the breeding and it will be o/s based when it comes to stayers.

Online wily ole dog

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« 2013-Oct-31, 06:44 AM Reply #22 »
Even the sprinters mate

The days of the "colonial" breed and gone....sadly.

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2013-Nov-04, 11:05 PM Reply #23 »
Year 1st 2nd 3rd Notes
2012 Precedence Niwot Lights Of Heaven
2011 Niwot Precedence The Verminator
2010 Maluckyday So You Think Zipping
2009 Shocking Master O'Reilly Alcopop
2008 Viewed Master O'Reilly Moatize
2007 Efficient Zipping Dolphin Jo
2006 Maybe Better Zipping Mahtoum
2005 Makybe Diva On A Jeune Leica Falcon
2004 Makybe Diva Zazzman Elvestroem
2003 Makybe Diva She's Archie Pentastic
2002 Mr Prudent Pentastic Rain Gauge
2001 Karasi Rain Gauge Sky Heights
2000 Brew Yippyio Freemason
1999 Rogan Josh Lahar (DH) Zazabelle (DH) (DH 2nd)
1998 Tie The Knot Skybeau Perpetual Check
1997 Might And Power Doriemus Markham
1996 Saintly Count Chivas Skybeau
1995 Doriemus Nothin' Leica Dane Coachwood
1994 Paris Lane Oompala Alcove

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2013-Nov-04, 11:08 PM Reply #24 »
This year's field:

Ethiopia
Fawkner
Super Cool
Hawkspur
Dear Demi

Does that look right?

Precedence should have been included in the field because he ran in the first two in the last two runnings.


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