2018 LEXUS MELBOURNE CUP G1 3200m 6th Nov - Racing Talk - Racehorse TALK
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2018 LEXUS MELBOURNE CUP G1 3200m 6th Nov - Racing Talk - Racehorse TALK

Author Topic: 2018 LEXUS MELBOURNE CUP G1 3200m 6th Nov  (Read 6676 times)

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Offline Authorized

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« 2018-Nov-06, 06:36 PM Reply #200 »
Rekindling went from 110 to 115
Cross Counter went from 109 to 115

115 will see him on about 58 kgs and we all know Carpenter does not like 58 kgs and he will overreact to the domination of 3yos in the Cup.

Obviously it depends on what he does between now and when the 2019 weights are released but I can not see him winning too many races between now and then.

I doubt he will be crucified next year and he will be ridden by William Buick.


Online Peter Mair

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« 2018-Nov-06, 06:56 PM Reply #201 »


Visual Vet

The death of a horse today is likely to be 'blamed' on the Cup.

.............. this horse was probably 'sentenced' in the Caulfield Cup  when it was racing erratically to finish 3rd.

Big prize-money brings pressure to perform that may take its toll -- as MW said of his prince.

Offline Wenona

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« 2018-Nov-06, 06:59 PM Reply #202 »
If you don't get  :censored: ing banned I'm outa here.

Everything about you is anti-racing why you are given air here is beyond me.
« Last Edit: 2018-Nov-06, 07:07 PM by Wenona »

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« 2018-Nov-06, 06:59 PM Reply #203 »
Hugh Bowman handed hefty suspension
James Tzaferis James Tzaferis@Jtzaf   6:35pm

Champion jockey Hugh Bowman will miss a month of feature racing after being hit with a whopping 35-meeting suspension out of Tuesday’s Lexus Melbourne Cup.

Bowman was cited on three separate charges in the $7.3 million race - an incident of careless riding at the 500m, excessive whip use prior to the final 100m and the fact that he weighed in more than half a kilogram over his prescribed weight of 55kg aboard runner-up Marmelo.

Marmelo looked the winner when he hit the front at the 200m but was run down late by Cross Counter and eventually went under by a length.

Stewards found him guilty on all three charges and issued separate suspensions of 12 meetings for careless riding, eight meetings for whip use and 21 meetings for the weight infringement.

The respective bans totalled 41 meetings, however, stewards, at their discretion, ordered the ban to stand at 35 meetings.

The four-time Cox Plate-winning rider will miss the prized mounts of Latrobe in the Mackinnon Stakes (2000m) and last-start Manikato Stakes winner Brave Smash in the Darley Classic on Saturday.

The ban will also see him sidelined for Group 1 meetings in Hong Kong and Japan, also ruling out a defence of his Japan Cup scalp of 2017.

Bowman, who didn't rule out an appeal against the severity of the suspension, will be free to return for the prized Hong Kong International meeting in mid-December.

Five other jockeys, including winning pilot Kerrin McEvoy, were fined for breaching the whip rule in the Melbourne Cup.

McEvoy was fined $3000 after using the whip nine times - four more than what is permitted under the rules - on Cross Counter in the final 400m of the race.

Jim Crowley (Race 6 - 10 meetings) and Christine Puls (Race 10 - 10 meetings) were suspended for careless riding on the undercard at Flemington.ENDS

Very severe penalty (possibly the visitors rule applied) you would think he might have made it more interesting only for the more than  half kilo over although the winner put in a terriffic finish coming from last after very nearly getting clobbered when the horse broke down very lucky to escape but a great win only his 8th start in a race.

Once the stewards report is published we'll see how the overuse of the whip penalties applied to the two riders compare.


Giddy Up :beer:




Offline ratsack

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« 2018-Nov-06, 08:16 PM Reply #204 »
If you don't get  :censored: ing banned I'm outa here.

Everything about you is anti-racing why you are given air here is beyond me.

o dear another long term member bites the dust

?

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2018-Nov-06, 08:34 PM Reply #205 »

Very severe penalty (possibly the visitors rule applied) you would think he might have made it more interesting only for the more than  half kilo over although the winner put in a terriffic finish coming from last after very nearly getting clobbered when the horse broke down very lucky to escape but a great win only his 8th start in a race.

Once the stewards report is published we'll see how the overuse of the whip penalties applied to the two riders compare.


Giddy Up :beer:


Absolutely outrageous penalty that could only be explained by the fact he is from NSW and the stewards from Victoria.

Hope he appeals.

Offline Wenona

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« 2018-Nov-06, 08:42 PM Reply #206 »
o dear another long term member bites the dust

?

Not that long ... only 18 years since joining the original Racenet forum  :bye:

Offline sobig

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« 2018-Nov-06, 08:52 PM Reply #207 »
Full stewards report from the cup

ace 7 - Lexus Melbourne Cup (Group 1) - 3200m:

A Prince Of Arran (GB) - began awkwardly. Rider Michael Walker was fined the sum of $400 under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(i) for using his whip for three consecutive strides prior to the 100m, which is not permitted.

Best Solution (IRE) - stood flat footed and lost ground (six lengths) and a warning will be placed on the horses record.

Marmelo (GB) - began awkwardly and then attempted to savage Avilius (GB) and a warning will be placed on the horses record. A post race veterinary examination revealed the horse to be lame in the off hind leg and will require a veterinary clearance prior to racing again.

Avilius (GB) - slow to begin. Hampered to avoid the injured The Cliffsofmoher (IRE) passing the winning post on the first occasion. A post race veterinary examination revealed the gelding had sustained lacerations to its off fore fetlock.

The Cliffsofmoher (IRE) - passing the winning post on the first occasion, suffered a catastrophic racing injury and was eased out of the event; Avilius (GB) and Cross Counter (GB) which were following were hampered as a consequence. The horse was humanely euthanised and the incident will be referred to the Equine Welfare Department.

Cross Counter (GB) - hampered to avoid the injured The Cliffsofmoher (IRE) passing the winning post on the first occasion. Near the 500m was steadied away from the heels of Muntahaa (IRE) (Jim Crowley) which shifted out; Jim Crowley was notified to exercise care. Rider Kerrin McEvoy was fined the sum of $3000 under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip nine times prior to the 100m, which is four times more than permitted. In assessing penalty Stewards took into account that he won the race.

Sound Check (GER) - raced four wide without cover in the early and middle stages.

Rostropovich (IRE) - raced three wide without cover in the early and middle stages. Laid in under pressure in the straight.

Muntahaa (IRE) - disappointed for a run near the 500m between Youngstar and Yucatan.

Youngstar - rider Craig Williams reported that his mount laid inwards in the straight.

Nakeeta (GB) - rider Regan Bayliss was fined the sum of $1500 under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip ten times prior to the 100m, which is five times more than permitted.

Sir Charles Road - rider Dwayne Dunn was fined the sum of $800 under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip nine times prior to the 100m, which is four times more than permitted.

Zacada (NZ) - rider Damian Lane was fined the sum of $800 under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip nine times prior to the 100m, which is four times more than permitted.

Auvray (FR) - lost its off fore plate in running.

Yucatan (IRE) - a post race veterinary examination revealed the horse to be lame in the near foreleg and will require a veterinary clearance prior to racing again.

Magic Circle (IRE) - a post race endoscopic examination detected a degree in internal exercise induced pulmonary haemorrhage and a veterinary clearance is required prior to racing again.

Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge of careless riding under the provisions of AR137(a), the carelessness being that near the 500m he permitted his mount to shift in when not clear of Chestnut Coat (JPN) resulting in that horse being checked when tightened for room. Hugh Bowman had his licence to ride in races suspended for a period of twelve race meetings. In assessing penalty Stewards took into account his guilty plea and good record and that the carelessness was in the mid-range.

Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip twelve times prior to the 100m, which is seven times more than permitted. Hugh Bowman had his licence to ride in races for a period of eight race meetings. In assessing penalty Stewards took into account his gross breach of the rule in a Group 1 event.

Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge under the provisions of AR145 for returning to scale more than a half kilogram over his declared riding weight. Hugh Bowman has his licence to ride in races suspended for a period of twenty-one race meetings.

Stewards deemed that all three suspensions be served cumulatively, however to avoid making his term of suspension manifestly excessive, Hugh Bowmans licence to ride in races was suspended for a period to commence at midnight November 8th and to expire at midnight December 8th, a total of thirty-five race meetings (one calendar month).

 

Offline fours

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« 2018-Nov-06, 10:55 PM Reply #208 »
Gintara,

For my main method(s) I certainly do but Bowman gets 35 days suspension for ruining Wily and my shared bet prize. The horse was just about to be popped the ? when he got shoved out of contention and lost momentum. The folly of betting around 1 horses exposed 2 years in a row for shared prize bets in the Cup.

Fours


Offline specialweek2

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« 2018-Nov-06, 11:43 PM Reply #209 »
If you don't get  :censored: ing banned I'm outa here.

Everything about you is anti-racing why you are given air here is beyond me.
Once again. How is this relative.
You are not a horse person so you cannot comment.
Sorry wrong quote, Wenona. You know.

« Last Edit: 2018-Nov-06, 11:45 PM by specialweek2 »

Offline firezuki

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« 2018-Nov-07, 01:33 AM Reply #210 »
I've given Sandboy the winner of the last two Cups.


If his binocular lenses aren't as big as the frigging Hubble telescope, he has no-one to blame but himself. 

Offline Bubbasmith

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« 2018-Nov-07, 06:11 AM Reply #211 »
As one would expect the lefties , on the ABC at least, are all over the death of a horse in the Cup and of course the number of jockeys fined for excessive whipping of  their mounts. As they pay down to 12th  ($150.000) in the Cup it is little wonder why jockeys ride their horses right out and receive  those fines , the lefties, of course, are trying to muddy the water to equate that excessive whipping happens in all races.

Offline nemisis

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« 2018-Nov-07, 07:48 AM Reply #212 »
I was an animal lover long before I became a 'leftie' and I can assure you that you can never get use to watching breakdowns like that.

3 weeks ago when Gustavus Vassa broke down at the 1000 metres everyone carried like nothing had happened.
Very different when it's right in everyone's eyes like yesterday.
Many people's eyes would not have left that horse from the time it happened.

Horse break downs and excessive whip use are just some of the animal welfare issues that will always haunt horse racing and they are charges that have to be faced and those in control are very aware of it.


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« 2018-Nov-07, 08:06 AM Reply #213 »
EXTRACT FROM STEWARDS REPORT Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge of careless riding under the provisions of AR137(a), the carelessness being that near the 500m he permitted his mount to shift in when not clear of Chestnut Coat (JPN) resulting in that horse being checked when tightened for room. Hugh Bowman had his licence to ride in races suspended for a period of twelve race meetings. In assessing penalty Stewards took into account his guilty plea and good record and that the carelessness was in the mid-range.

Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge under the provisions of AR137A(5)(a)(ii) for using his whip twelve times prior to the 100m, which is seven times more than permitted. Hugh Bowman had his licence to ride in races for a period of eight race meetings. In assessing penalty Stewards took into account his gross breach of the rule in a Group 1 event.

Hugh Bowman (Marmelo (GB)) - pleaded guilty to a charge under the provisions of AR145 for returning to scale more than a half kilogram over his declared riding weight. Hugh Bowman has his licence to ride in races suspended for a period of twenty-one race meetings.

Stewards deemed that all three suspensions be served cumulatively, however to avoid making his term of suspension manifestly excessive, Hugh Bowmans licence to ride in races was suspended for a period to commence at midnight November 8th and to expire at midnight December 8th, a total of thirty-five race meetings (one calendar month)


 IMO 35 days out is an abuse of power...... an obvious excessive penalty which on any fair assessment will be overturned on appeal ...12 meetings for interference ...8 meetings for excessive use of the whip 7over ........admittedly 7 over was in excess of other whip violations ..McEvoy 4 over $3K fine.....Bayliss 5 over $1.5K fine .....Lane & Dunn both 4 over same as McEvoy fined $800...and 21 for being overweight...all cumulative but in their wisdom "however to avoid making his term of suspension manifestly excessive, Hugh Bowmans licence to ride in races was suspended for a period to commence at midnight November 8th and to expire at midnight December 8th, a total of thirty-five race meetings (one calendar month" a reduction of 6 meetings.....so down from manifestly excessive to just plain excessive...the stewards in their own words have shot themselves in the foot.


Giddy Up :beer:


Offline Bubbasmith

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« 2018-Nov-07, 08:09 AM Reply #214 »
I noted before the Cup that the Cross Counter was to race "with front bandages for the first time", however looking at photos in the press today it appears, at least to me, there are no bandages on the horse's front legs.
« Last Edit: 2018-Nov-07, 08:13 AM by Bubbasmith »

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« 2018-Nov-07, 09:42 AM Reply #215 »
How the tipsters went ...not too many had the winner on top......I had an interest EW first and second plus Yucatan and Youngstar ...took TT+ but big mistake in taking fixed odds the place well under tote.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/horse-racing/melbourne-cup/melbourne-cup-2018-who-the-experts-and-celebrities-are-tipping-to-win/news-story/16ca1ae3bfecb31ba2a93a5e210bb9ec

Giddy up :beer:

Online JWesleyHarding

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« 2018-Nov-07, 10:19 AM Reply #216 »
Yes, Marshall selected the winner but his rationale was off-beam.

"Champion (sic) jockey Simon Marshall gave Foxsports.com.au readers his expert tip for the Melbourne Cup and he was spot on, selecting Cross Counter to win.

“I’ve watched his English races and he’s got the tactical speed to overcome his wide alley" "

Offline Spudda028

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« 2018-Nov-07, 11:14 AM Reply #217 »
Very pleased to say whilst I personally didn't have winning bets on the cup ( Humidor long range selection ) the Punters Club that former forumite El Zoro runs that i am part of had out top 4 returnees for the year nominate 2 picks each for a $100 First 4. We ended up with 7 picks and 12% of $33k so almost $4k back which get s distributed evenly amongst whole group. - Sadly I was 6th in returns at this point so wasn't part of the 4 nominating selections. Well done El Zoro Chuggers and the other two punters club members who selected these:

Selections 2, 5, 9, 10, 13, 17, 23      

$3,971.00   RETURN

This was final bets for the club this year and was a nice way to finish. If anyone is interested in joining next year send me a PM it lasts for 35 weeks and covers a whole range of sports and racing bets / selections including a footy tipping comp and sports predictors comps which are long range and bloody fun! Plus there is a get together at the track in August each year - makes for a great day out!

Offline Bubbasmith

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« 2018-Nov-08, 06:21 AM Reply #218 »


 Plus there is a get together at the track in August each year - makes for a great day out!
Which track ? It is a bit cold at Elwick down here in Tassy in August. :chin:

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« 2018-Nov-08, 09:22 AM Reply #219 »
Marmelo owners deny Bowman blunder cost win

GILBERT GARDINER

APPEALING: Hugh Bowman is trying to reduce his ban.

OWNERS of Melbourne Cup runner-up Marmelo have backed champion jockey Hugh Bowman, saying his weight blunder did not cost them the $7.3 million Flemington feature on Tuesday.

Melbourne property developer and nightclub owner Aziz “Ozzie” Kheir said Bowman returning to scale 1kg over the allotted 56kg had no bearing on the result.

Marmelo was mowed down by lightweight Cross Counter in the shadows of the post, losing down by a length.

“I don’t think it would have made that much difference on the result,” Kheir said.

Before the race, Bowman weighed 56.4kg, within the 500g leeway given to jockeys on race day, but returned at 57kg and then failed to give an explanation to stewards.

The Sydney-based jockey, who notably has partnered four-time Cox Plate winner Winx in 29 of her 39 career starts, will challenge a 35-meeting suspension – the result of three separate charges – handed down by stewards.

Bowman was also penalised for careless riding and excessive whip use.

The suspension means he will miss Group 1 rides at Flemington on Saturday and the chance to chase back-to-back Japan Cups on November 25.

Racing Victoria chief handicapper Greg Carpenter said the margin would have been closer than it was had Marmelo carried 56kg.

“It is theoretical but over 3200m the standard thinking is that half a kilogram is roughly the equivalent of a length,” Carpenter said yesterday.

“It would have made it very close, much closer than it was, in theory.”

But Kheir, who toasted Melbourne Cup success in 2014 with Protectionist, yesterday praised Bowman’s “amazing ride”.

“I don’t think it would’ve changed the result,” he said.

“Our horse is a big horse and he probably would’ve handled the extra weight anyway.”

Bowman, who pleaded guilty to all charges, will appeal the severity of the ban.

Racing Victoria chairman of stewards Robert Cram said jockeys generally had to be careful with food and drinks on race day.

“If they eat, drink or change their gear it can make a difference,” Cram said. “It could be a combination of drink (or) food

– he never put that forward.

“Some jockeys get caught out changing their gear.

“There’s only one person that will know and that will be the jockey.”


Giddy Up :beer:


Offline firezuki

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« 2018-Nov-08, 03:11 PM Reply #220 »
Is there a deli at about the 1000m mark that Hugh might have quickly stopped off at?

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2018-Nov-08, 04:15 PM Reply #221 »


Racing Victoria chief handicapper Greg Carpenter said the margin would have been closer than it was had Marmelo carried 56kg.

“It is theoretical but over 3200m the standard thinking is that half a kilogram is roughly the equivalent of a length,” Carpenter said yesterday.


Giddy Up :beer:


1 length = 1 kg over 3200m is what Don Scott would have used.

Offline pegasyber

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« 2018-Nov-08, 05:12 PM Reply #222 »
   Gee Peter Mair, I thought you would be the first one to thank me for the workings for the Melbourne Cup, well before race time, F4 bet in colour, not too hard to read and I even put the Winning Post in just for you. And done with just a Pencil and Paper!.

Quote
VF140817 MC70611F * RACE NAME ID* [ MC70611F  2018. LEXUS MELBOURNE CUP,,,,,,,,,,, 3200 mtrs]. COMPRUN 11-05-2018. AT 16:01:43 RESULT  [   23  9  17   13           ]  F4 $32k, $33k  $38k
 * * * *  * * * * * * * * *  *  * * * *         :bash: Winning Post
VF140817 MC70611F * LOW LRAC WDIV [  9  23  17  13 16  ] [  9 MARMELO W%.  ---  ].[ 23 CROSS COUN.  ---  ].[ 17 A PRINCE O. a *LR7DS* ].[ 13 FINCHE W% .  ---  ].[ 16 VENTURA ST.  ---  ].[ ] F4 & 5LOW WDIV E/W BET *

 
« Last Edit: 2018-Nov-10, 01:47 AM by pegasyber »

Online Peter Mair

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« 2018-Nov-08, 05:20 PM Reply #223 »


Well done as usual pega -- regret did not see it ahead of time -- where were the numbers pre-published, please?

Offline pegasyber

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« 2018-Nov-08, 05:24 PM Reply #224 »
  In this Melbourne Cup thread, posts 148 and 152, but now removed due to absolute and total  lack of interest; even invited anyone who read it that as it had no copyright restriction to post it t anybody or everybody.  But never again! 
« Last Edit: 2018-Nov-08, 05:39 PM by pegasyber »


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