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Online jfc

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« 2015-Aug-13, 03:42 PM Reply #50 »
Aren't you constantly telling us about rebates for large overseas punters and then informing us that we are being ripped off - I've always maintained it is TABCorp shareholders being ripped off but that is the subject of another thread.

If you think large volumes are coming into the TAB pools due to rebate merchants, and you don't know if they are skewing the stats (they very well could be - a plausible scenario) then your conclusions could be wrong.
Obfuscation indeed.

How on earth can you get this so mixed up?

i was talking about Betfair where Kickbacks are disclosed, and irrelevant to this comparison.

Why you want to drag Totes into this is incomprehensible.

But, even so, for Totes there is no difference between Kickbacks for NSW or Vic races.



Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2015-Aug-13, 03:49 PM Reply #51 »
Obfuscation indeed.

How on earth can you get this so mixed up?

i was talking about Betfair where Kickbacks are disclosed, and irrelevant to this comparison.

Why you want to drag Totes into this is incomprehensible.

But, even so, for Totes there is no difference between Kickbacks for NSW or Vic races.


Sorry. Too many threads crossing grey areas. Yes. I did think you were talking about TAB pools  :shy:

Online jfc

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« 2015-Aug-13, 03:57 PM Reply #52 »
Sorry. Too many threads crossing grey areas. Yes. I did think you were talking about TAB pools  :shy:
OK.

Now, Kickbacks are the same for NSW and Vic on Totes.

The fact that you can get different Kickbacks in Supertab versus NSW TAB makes no difference to the above.
 

Online jfc

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« 2015-Aug-26, 06:43 PM Reply #53 »
Wonder what the Australian implications might be.



https://twitter.com/TheBigSwan/status/636423292576894977/photo/1

Offline Peter Mair

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« 2015-Aug-27, 12:00 AM Reply #54 »


The sense of amusement is hardly warranted when local money lost is being sent overseas -- all with the encouragement of local levies and  TAB takeouts.

Imagine if HK ever decided to let Betfair run in open international company from a HK base.

Online jfc

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« 2015-Aug-29, 05:39 PM Reply #55 »
Further to comparing race average Betfair Markets for Saturday Sydney versus Melbourne.

August Saturdays:

Melbourne vs Sydney:

+5%
+22%
+25%
+30%
+48%

+27% Average

With the extra Melbourne race:

+42% overall!

August 2014 figures were similar.

This highlights a serious problem for Sydney.

Online jfc

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« 2015-Sep-02, 08:55 AM Reply #56 »
Wonder why the authorities didn't ban the launderers?

Wonder why they don't see the available Betfair forensics as a great way of tracking down launderer connections?

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/betfair-used-by-gangland-figure-horty-mokbel-for-money-laundering-20150901-gjcpul.html?utm_campaign=echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#link_time=1441139223

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2015-Sep-02, 09:18 AM Reply #57 »
Wonder why the authorities didn't ban the launderers?

Wonder why they don't see the available Betfair forensics as a great way of tracking down launderer connections?

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/betfair-used-by-gangland-figure-horty-mokbel-for-money-laundering-20150901-gjcpul.html?utm_campaign=echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#link_time=1441139223


I think the authors of that article, and the sub-editor have never been to a racetrack in their life. You'd think someone writing an article like that would know the difference between Cranbourne race track and Cranbourne trotting track.

"The images of Sequenzia at Cranbourne show him freely associating with others trackside and in what appears to be an owners area, and gambling at on-course betting machines."

  :lol:




Online sobig

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« 2015-Sep-02, 12:00 PM Reply #58 »
PP

Cranbourne trotting track is inside the race track

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2015-Sep-02, 06:23 PM Reply #59 »
PP

Cranbourne trotting track is inside the race track

Fair enough. But mate. Did you read the article?

The guy in question, we are told at the start of the article, owns a pacer Fake Smile. As jfc says, he is not banned.

But we get "revelations" like this:

Pictures have emerged of Sequenzia at Cranbourne on August 25, watching his horse Fake Smile win the fifth win in five starts for the horse.

There are pictures taken by the "scoops" sent to Cranbourne of him:

i) Watching the horses parade and
ii) Walking out of the TAB area

So the guy is going to Cranbourne trots, quite legally, to watch his horse run and have a bet.

The picture of him emerging from the betting area looks suspiciously like it is taken by a hidden camera.

And the language....

"in what appears to be an owners area...". Has the reporter been locked up in a monastery for the last 25 years?

I found it hilarious for it's naivety   :lol:


Offline Peter Mair

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« 2015-Sep-08, 03:24 AM Reply #60 »


TAB punters want a fair bet -- and any Betfair will do

Whatever social harm may be done by online gambling, betting on the races is hardly the main problem.

A problem in Australia is that too much social waste is Associated With too much racing.

Whatever the following inquiry finds, let us hope that we can still find a Betfair somewhere on line in due course.



Former NSW premier Barry O'Farrell will head a federal government-backed review of offshore online wagering sites operating illegally on Australian sports.

 



Social services minister Scott Morrison announced the initiative on Monday and follows a pre-election pledge from Tony Abbott to tighten the regulation of online betting.

There are nearly 30 wagering firms operating legally in Australia however Mr Morrison is concerned about the leakage of funds away from Australia to firms operating without approval or paying taxes or product fees.

"Almost 60 per cent of the $1.6 billion online gambling industry is going offshore to more than 2000 sites beyond the control of Australian regulators," Mr Morrison said at a media conference in Canberra.

"For the vast majority of Australians having a punt is part of a recreational pass time for many generations and it's part of who we are."

Terms of reference for the review will include the economic impacts of illegal sites on legal Australian businesses and international measures with representatives from the racing industry, professional sports, wagering organisations and state and territory governments to be consulted.

Racing Australia chief executive Peter McGuaran welcomed the review.

"The thoroughbred racing industry strongly supports the Government's action in the face of a rapidly changing and evolving on-line landscape," McGuaran said in a statement.

"If left unchecked, racing authorities believe that the integrity of Australian racing and sports is at considerable risk."

Recommendations will be given to the federal government by December 18.



[ PS do not own any part of a racehorse lest one becomes a licensed person and says the wrong thing or not the right thing!]

Offline whispering

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« 2015-Sep-08, 08:19 AM Reply #61 »
PP he is one person mentioned more  than once in the sam k et al enquiries.


I think someone who doesnt know that cranny race course is a multi purpose venue is a little less knowledgable than the writer.

Anyway racing journos are uselsss, it always takes a crime writer to figure these things out. The tele cannot write anything negative and smh is virtually the same crap.

When you have people like pete defend bz for deliberately misleading the public...

More money goes to asian exchanges than all other platforms combined.

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2015-Sep-08, 10:32 AM Reply #62 »
PP he is one person mentioned more  than once in the sam k et al enquiries.


I think someone who doesnt know that cranny race course is a multi purpose venue is a little less knowledgable than the writer.

Anyway racing journos are uselsss, it always takes a crime writer to figure these things out. The tele cannot write anything negative and smh is virtually the same crap.

When you have people like pete defend bz for deliberately misleading the public...

More money goes to asian exchanges than all other platforms combined.

I accept you Victorian's have superior knowledge of their track structures  ;)

And the guy in question may very well be "well connected".

But my criticism is limited to the journalism and the so called "investigative journalism" displayed here. Looks like they have sent a reporter or reporters out to Cranny who have no idea what they are reporting on.

There is a trend in journalism that seems to say "because we are conducting investigative journalism we are not bound to the normal rules of privacy and decency that would be usually afforded to individuals not found guilty of any particular crime. Furthermore we reserve the right to imply that these individuals are guilty, and to publish illegally obtained information without having to reveal our sources, even if we committed a criminal act in paying for this information".

Nothing has been learnt from the News Of The World Scandal by Australian journalists regarding ethics. All that has been learnt is how not to get caught.

I see a hidden camera used on some guy out at Cranbourne trots watching his horse and maybe having a bet on it. I do not see anything else, and that includes the inferences made by the crappy journalism displayed in that article. Has your newspaper got any real evidence? Then put up or shut up.

Offline Manetalk

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« 2015-Sep-20, 06:18 PM Reply #63 »
Fair enough. But mate. Did you read the article?

The guy in question, we are told at the start of the article, owns a pacer Fake Smile. As jfc says, he is not banned.

But we get "revelations" like this:

Pictures have emerged of Sequenzia at Cranbourne on August 25, watching his horse Fake Smile win the fifth win in five starts for the horse.

There are pictures taken by the "scoops" sent to Cranbourne of him:

i) Watching the horses parade and
ii) Walking out of the TAB area

So the guy is going to Cranbourne trots, quite legally, to watch his horse run and have a bet.

The picture of him emerging from the betting area looks suspiciously like it is taken by a hidden camera.

And the language....

"in what appears to be an owners area...". Has the reporter been locked up in a monastery for the last 25 years?

I found it hilarious for it's naivety    :lol:  


Another typically fine example of so-called investigation journalist Nick McKenzie's absolute crap. His nonsense stories are always full of "alleged" , "it is believed", etc to circumnavigate the defamation laws. This goose is the same bloke who keeps having a go at blokes like Gatto, Madaferri, The Sequenzia & The Mokbels. Methinks he's a likely candidate to end up as Luca Brasi did - swimming with the fishes.

Online jfc

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« 2015-Nov-03, 06:51 AM Reply #64 »
Betfair seems to be pulling out all stops to be even more incompetent.

For Fleminton it can't be bothered entering day old scratchings.

And for its Quinella the raging favourite is Odds On Any Other!

Trouble is very few people actually play that, so revenue just goes down the tube.

Years ago I tried explaing to them they should add in more Combinations that people would be interested backing , but that was about as successful as trying to reason with PP7.

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2015-Nov-03, 07:12 AM Reply #65 »
Years ago I tried explaing to them they should add in more Combinations that people would be interested backing , but that was about as successful as trying to reason with PP7.

I'm a very reasonable person jfc. You can always use logic and reason with me, and I will respond with logic and reason  :biggrin:

Happy 200th birthday to George Boole yesterday  :cake:

Online jfc

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« 2015-Nov-03, 07:13 AM Reply #66 »
What a fascinating effort from RWW's BFF!

How is it that no one from the brain tank has suggested checking out Sertorious on Betfair?

And noted that $460 was once bountifully available at Betfair.

http://ausrace.com/pipermail/ausrace/2015-November/035350.html

Online jfc

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« 2016-May-16, 08:55 AM Reply #67 »

Offline fours

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« 2016-May-16, 01:58 PM Reply #68 »
jfc,

Can't see the defamation there!

 It's what good big  business does to little business after all! Step 1 remove the annoying competition by taking on board losses which you can sit throught but they cant. Step 2 if this fails take them over to remove them. Step 3 Once removed UP UP UP the margins go.

SOP and hardly defamatory.

Virgin's various businesses,... and the copy cats Woolworths and Coles, prey on such high margin business in turn by attacking the well established high margin businesses by undercutting them. Again SOP

Yes there are regulations by govts to keep these big boys in check.... and these do result in prosecutions from time to time... angels they aint but defamed... hardly! In fact one could say they were defamed if it was alleged they did not try anything like this!

Fours


Offline fours

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« 2016-May-16, 02:09 PM Reply #69 »
2015-Aug-06, 02:00 PM Reply #24 Quote from: PoisonPen7 on 2015-Jul-14, 09:47  AM


Jamie Packer's Betfair and Crown are currently trying to steal wagering revenue off their competitors and I think their tactic is to suffer a little short term pain with the vision thing while they run the smaller corporates out of business.

Wonder how defamation lawyers would view such an accusation?


Sorry jfc - software took me to the bottom of page 1 of this thread rather than to the end of the thread....

Fours

Online jfc

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« 2016-May-16, 04:22 PM Reply #70 »
"Steal" suggests something illegal.

Very easy to build a defamation ploy around that alone.

Remember Mair's defamation issues with V'landys.

I saw nothing at all defamatory in his posts but that didn't deter V'landys  in his deranged vendetta.
.

Offline PoisonPen7

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« 2016-May-16, 10:47 PM Reply #71 »
"Steal" suggests something illegal.

Very easy to build a defamation ploy around that alone.

Remember Mair's defamation issues with V'landys.

I saw nothing at all defamatory in his posts but that didn't deter V'landys  in his deranged vendetta.
.

If you parse the sentence and take the word "steal" in isolation it does.

In the context of the whole sentence, it means that they are trying to win market share legally.

But I suppose you have to be careful in this day and age. We live in the Age Of Sentence Parsing.

Please replace the word steal with the word win in this sentence.

Jamie Packer's Betfair and Crown are currently trying to steal win wagering revenue off their competitors

There. Ya happy now.  :censored:  me. If it isn't abusive and threatening PM's I'm getting from 3 forum "sickos" several times a week, it is people constantly whinging about Qld racing or people telling you that you are posting defamatory stuff.

Does anyone posting here actually find the forum and/or racing a positive experience any more?  :wacko:

Offline nemisis

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« 2016-May-17, 06:15 PM Reply #72 »
If you parse the sentence and take the word "steal" in isolation it does.

In the context of the whole sentence, it means that they are trying to win market share legally.

But I suppose you have to be careful in this day and age. We live in the Age Of Sentence Parsing.

Please replace the word steal with the word win in this sentence.

Jamie Packer's Betfair and Crown are currently trying to steal win wagering revenue off their competitors

There. Ya happy now.  :censored:  me. If it isn't abusive and threatening PM's I'm getting from 3 forum "sickos" several times a week, it is people constantly whinging about Qld racing or people telling you that you are posting defamatory stuff.

Does anyone posting here actually find the forum and/or racing a positive experience any more?  :wacko:
                  There's always something positive here PP7.
                Having a whinge is what people do on forums from time to time, I've spotted plenty of yours.

                 You just need a good winner so I'll tip you into Randwick tomorrow R3 no14 High Wind.
                It will either give you a positive experience or whatever but rest assured if it doesn't win I will lose a lot more than you. :)


Online jfc

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« 2016-May-17, 06:54 PM Reply #73 »
If you parse the sentence and take the word "steal" in isolation it does.

In the context of the whole sentence, it means that they are trying to win market share legally.

But I suppose you have to be careful in this day and age. We live in the Age Of Sentence Parsing.

Please replace the word steal with the word win in this sentence.

Jamie Packer's Betfair and Crown are currently trying to steal win wagering revenue off their competitors

There. Ya happy now.  :censored:  me. If it isn't abusive and threatening PM's I'm getting from 3 forum "sickos" several times a week, it is people constantly whinging about Qld racing or people telling you that you are posting defamatory stuff.

Does anyone posting here actually find the forum and/or racing a positive experience any more?  :wacko:
Replace "steal" with "win" and the sentence becomes inconsequential.

Every wagering outfit is trying to improve market share.

Who needs to read that!

"Steal" was clearly intended to suggest some impropriety by Crown and Betfair.

But there is no evidence that they are doing anything wrong. Or acting worse than their rivals.

The Corporates are clearly growing market share. Therefore Tabcorp and UBET are losing. No matter how they try to spin their figures.

It's hardly a revelation but TAH and TTS have only themselves to blame.

They hiked rakes. Allowing their competitors even more scope to undercut them.



Online jfc

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« 2016-May-28, 09:46 AM Reply #74 »
Despite the headline this article is really about a Betfair problem.

Like every other moronic outfit in this caper Betfair lets a handful of privileged perps stitch the game up so no one else can get a look in.

And it keeps getting worse.

It is very easy to stop.

Betfair facilitates invisible bet and has an insane minimum Lay risk of up to $5,000.

Perfect for manipulators.

Annoying for everyone else.

http://www.vocativ.com/322970/the-worst-of-wall-street-is-taking-over-sports-betting/


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