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Offline westie

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O.P. « 2008-Oct-26, 08:13 PM »
It commenced with RACENET



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From: basil Sent: 8/1/2001 4:16 PM
Here is the Max Prenell's article, as in SMH Monday July 30th
 
FORUM SILENCED
 
The loss of the Forum on Racenet, an internet site, is disappointing. It was one of the few TAB-free media areas where ideas, selections and opinions could be aired. "Dubaigate", an embarassment for TAB Ltd, came out of the discussion room. Alas it only takes one mug to cruel a good thing. Following a scurrilous and outrageous line about a racing personality, Racenet proprietor Glen Robbins has dropped the Forum. Robbins was as disappointed and upset by the cheapest of cheap shots and until he can get more protection for the innocent it will not re-appear.
<
« Last Edit: 2008-Oct-26, 10:16 PM by westie »

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:14 PM Reply #1 »
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From: entropy Sent: 26/07/2001 4:16 PM
from ausrace :
 
Hi xxxxxx,
Thanks for the suggestions.
We're looking at all the options but to be honest I wouldn't want to be
holding my breath.
Defamation is going to be an increasing risk with internet bulletin boards
and we have decided it is a risk we are not prepared to take. Defamation is
defined as: "publishing to persons, other than the person defamed, the
effect of which is to lower the reputation of the person (including
corporations)". It's pretty broad and does tend to be weighted against the
defendant.
Courts in particular hold a person's professional reputation very highly so
defamatory attacks on a person's professional integrity potentially magnify
the issue.
Every single bulletin board would have been guilty at some stage of the
above and the only option really is 100% moderation ie: all posts go through
the moderator before being made public. Technically if a defamatory message
is posted for just 5 minutes and read by a handful of people then you'll
have a hard time defending it if push came to shove. That's an extreme case
I know but the amount of traffic on Racenet makes it impossible to monitor
the posts so posts which should be removed immediately are often there for
hours.
Terms and Conditions at the end of the day will not count for much as an
argument based on normal duty of care would be a strong one, particularly as
racing bulletin boards tend to be controversial so you couldn't defend
yourself by merely "pleading ignorance".
The other unfortunate situation is that it has been tried and tested in
overseas courts that websites who hold themselves out as moderating their
bulletin boards are digging themselves a hole. If a site for example warns
people not to post illegal messages and suggests they will remove them if
found will not have a leg to stand on if a defamatory message is broadcast.
The safest route is to include in the terms and conditions that the bulletin
board is not moderated which most are now doing.
For sites who are dealing in controversial material and making the above
type of statement then it is only a matter of when not if somebody takes
issue with them.
To be honest the thought of a tough moderator holds zero interest for me. I
don't think me, or any of our staff, are so important that we should be able
to dictate what is discussed or how it is discussed. It just seems to make
it all too sterile for mine.
That's our point of view but having said that we will be looking for a
solution. We've had a pretty big reaction from the users, many of whom have
offered some excellent ideas and if I can find a way to ensure the good
people can keep discussing stuff then it will be done.
I should also say that we did not close the forums because of any legal
threats. We have obviously had them in the past but this decision was not
influenced by anything other than some in depth inquiry and a desire to not
have anybody taking our hard earned thanks to some half wit who thought they
were anonymous.
regards
Craig

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:15 PM Reply #2 »
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From: entropy  (Original Message) Sent: 27/07/2001 11:39 AM
from letitride :
 
Author: goldfish 
Date:   Jul 25 - 07:46 AM
 

Went to the Racenet funeral today at St Patricks in town. Very sad day. Many attended. There were lots of speeches none more heart wrenching than one by Birdy & Soopy. They spoke of their love of Racenet and the the contraversial threads they posted over the last 12 months. Dolly interupted and just bagged them.
Filly was there. Looked sensational! Gelded spoke but we got lost a bit at the 1200m mark with all the facts and stats.Codmother drove most there in the coach and spoke of her trouble finding this "let it ride crap" Sunshine did'nt give a dam 'cause he's leaving anyway, and can't afford to log on 'cause he's so tight.Drunkathugos was drunkathugos and could'nt make it. Filly looked even better the second time I looked. Jet Fighter was really upset.....He's not even gunna bother with THIS forum. No Feng Shui here he reckons. Stabba just got into the gnome society again and unfortunately there was a bit of a scuffle. Admin broke it up by sending them to the Sin Bin. Stabba came back lookin' for Vic Rail but no Vic so he left. Crin arrived lookin' special as she does and thanked Birdy & Snoopy for all they had done. That was nice I thought. Big nose made a brief apperance but he's losin' weight so had to go and sauna. Also there was;Geegees, richo, AlefNeuman,gee cee,Billy,ajm, geoff, travis, monty, Filly (looked great), arnold,matterat,HomerJ, slade,melissab,jo1,and Sunshine's motor bike (crap heap). A sad day it was indeed but as Crin said in her speech....The old bloodstock is gone and it's time to breed new threads on LET IT RIDE. The Racenet "wake party" has been emailed to all former racenetters and it's at S. Baster's house but I'm not sure of the date. When you all see him at the races he'll give you details. Love to you all and good luck on this new forum.


Footnote: entropy has passed on since he posted this and if you do a google on his nic you can read some remarkable articiles.
« Last Edit: 2008-Oct-26, 08:17 PM by westie »

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:19 PM Reply #3 »
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From: clocker Sent: 29/07/2001 7:29 PM
I should reply to a couple of points in this thread.
Firstly a big congratulations to whoever got this going. Sensational effort. We'll put a link on Racenet to direct people here.
 
Also regarding the criticism of us pulling the Racenet forums down so quickly. Fair enough probably but we couldn't see the point in prolonging the agony. We didn't receive any legal threat to do so either. I'm absolutely filthy that we felt we had to do so however I've explained to Entropy some of the reasons why. Entropy if you want to make that email public here I don't mind.
 
Regarding the effect it has had on our traffic it has been negligible which we knew would be the case. It has obviously affected our hits but they mean nothing at the end of the day. The user sessions in the 4 days "post-forums" have been 21620 and for the same 4 days in the previous week they were 21777. (hits for those days if you're interested were 307,140 and 360,068 repectively). The form is by far the most popular part of Racenet and the Blackbook is bigger than the forums ever were. That's not meant to sound high handed, it's just a fact. I don't for a minute understate the "community" aspect of the forums which is why we aren't really happy they've gone but as far as traffic, participation and plain numbers are concerned they did look bigger than they were probably.
It's a crying shame considering the vast majority of good people who took part, some of whom we got to meet and hopefuly will continue to see but at the end of the day we felt we were in an unknown and potentially dangerous situation for our company and at the mercy of the lowest common denominator.
I really hope these kick on as strongly as our forums did and I look forward to taking part.
If anybody ever thinks Racenet can help in some way with threads and ideas which are bound to crop up we'll be more than happy to help if possible.

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:27 PM Reply #4 »
THE FORESIGHT


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From: reef_shark12  (Original Message) Sent: 31/07/2001 6:34 AM
Hi & thanks for dropping in to the NEW racing forum. It has been almost a week since I thought of a way to replace the Racenet Forums. I never thought it would be as populated in such a short time. So be patient & enjoy tour visits.
 
We will be conducting live chats, watch for a schedule being set. They are a good way to get to know others. Like the Message Boards I would like to think that the 'personal' rubbish be avoided by all. I won't stand for any crap. So whilst I want this community to grow as large as possible, I don't want personal attacks occurring. The community doesn't have a SIN BIN in place like Racenet did, but management does have the ability to ban members - this would be a last resort for me to utilise this idea, but if I see rubbish getting about by particular members they will not be here long.
 
Enough of the negativity, let's just get in & enjoy the talk on RACING, as well as any topics of interest. If everybody could be aware to try and use the relevant message board & avoid adding new discussions to the GENERAL board please. The photo albums are looking good too - well done everyone for getting involved & making it the place it is so far.
 
I will be in touch every now & again with the latest news & information - any questions you may have about the site please choose to send them to managers as opposed to creating new discussions - there is an option to do this.
 
Take it easy & bring on debate & discussion - it is more than welcomed...
 
Seeyas
 
REEF SHARK!

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:38 PM Reply #5 »
A few of the posts in the first couple of days

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From: <NOBR>NineMSN Nicknamewestie®</NOBR>  (Original Message) Sent: 25/07/2001 8:02 PM
reefy, thanks for the invite , I see the Forum has six excellent Foundation members. No way will this group, go the way of some recent company disasters.

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From: happy Sent: 25/07/2001 9:49 PM
thanks heaps westerly for telling me about this and thanks reefy for letting me join in, look forward to some of the good discussion that went on without the rubbish, and looking forward to the fotty arguements reefy, go the dogs

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From: <NOBR>NineMSN NicknameRodent™</NOBR> Sent: 26/07/2001 5:37 PM
Thanks to all for keeping the dream alive. (Long live Stumac's Belmont Challenge!)

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From: Buglet Sent: 26/07/2001 5:45 PM
Ha! Hey liddle rat u found us!   The challenge is back on!

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From: <NOBR>NineMSN Nicknamewestie®</NOBR> Sent: 26/07/2001 10:16 PM
Stumac hasn't come forward yet.  Does anyone have the results for last week or the week before.  Are we going to post our tips, perhaps reefy will set up a thead for us like the puntermatt competion - it could be deleted at the end of the comp.


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From: NineMSN Nicknamewestie® Sent: 26/07/2006 11:39 PM
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From: <NOBR>NineMSN Nicknamemelˇšša</NOBR> Sent: 28/07/2001 10:47 AM
Congrats guys, I got the invite a couple of days ago and have been flat chat since but finally have had time to look around and I must say this is fantastic, almost feels like home!  I have been an irregular poster on a couple of other forums, Cyberhorse & Let It Ride, but always preferred the format and environ of Racenet.  I had a quick chat with a couple ofguys last night in the chat room, Eddy, Chubby, Woody, Jetfighter, and Sladey and its an excellent addition to the site.  Well done on setting it all up I think you're on a winner!!  I've added it to my bookmarks so I will return!!!  Cheers. Melissab.  (BTW I also go by the name of Darley on a couple of other sites)

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From: woodywob Sent: 31/07/2001 9:54 AM
just wanted to say a BIG THANK YOU reefy.......i'm sure i speak for all members in commending your insight and efforts to start and co ordinate this site.....a special thanks must also go to Luskin Star, rad and 777 for the huge efforts they have put in....
 
..it's here now......what we make of it is up to us.......
cheers guys

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From: FastEddy Sent: 31/07/2001 10:34 AM
I agree woody , this site is a better place due to the efforts of the above named people , again I thank them for their efforts  cheers.
The Chat area is a great place to meet and get to know fellow forumites - I recommend it , if you haven't used it then try it out , check the Chat Schedule out to see if people are online or use it to post when you will be on.
The photo albums is getting to be more popular , some great pics of people's horses or their stables favs , check it out too.


Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 08:42 PM Reply #6 »
A Little History of TNHRCF from the Management
Although if not already archived may be lost


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From: NineMSN Nicknamewestie® Sent: 1/08/2006 2:11 PM
This forum began in late July 01 when Racenet decided to close their discussion forums. Reefshark discussed to prospect with a few others, and so began this form, it's original name in lieu of the closuer at Racenet. A few voices invited a few, who invited a few, who invited a few and so it grew. Today the site remains very active with some 400 to 600 hits a day depending in the time of the year, and although some members and or their activity comes and goes there has been consistent growth through the last few yrs. 
 
It's interesting to look back and some of the discussion through the last 5 yrs. Listed below is a collection of links to various threads that have made an appearence. Plenty of healthy industry discussion, notably betting exchanges; Betting Exchanges to be outlawed in Australia  (June 03) ;  Betting Exchanges - here today, gone tomorrow  (September 03)  , the TV war; Syd/Melb races on TVN/Sky??  (January 05) ; the NSW Tab new web site disaster New NSW TAB website  (February 05) ; the Australian Punters Association APA calls on ACCC to Block Merger of TAB Pools  (September 05) ; and Austote AusTOTE - Australia's First New TAB in Decades  (July 04) .
 
 
 
There was the odd race or racehorse that got a mention, Sunline, Northerly, Lonhro and the Diva probably stealing the show; Sunline V Makybe Diva  (March 05) ; NORTHERLY - A MIGHTY CHAMPION!  (October 02) ; Lonhro proves how good NORTHERLY WAS!  (October 03) ; It's Official. Lonhro is a Champion  (April 04) ; Is Makybe Diva one of the greats? (October 05) . And with all that talk of Champions, thankfully we even went there - Definition of a champion( ?)  (March 02) . And amongst others there was Silent Witness Silent Witness - wow...he is impressive.  (December 04) and Alinghi Alinghi's USA Campaign  (August 05) . Other discussion included Overrating the Cox Plate  (March 04) ; MAKYBE DIVA WILL NOT WIN A G1 THIS SPRING!  (September 05) ; Photo of B. Johns Returning to scale after slaughtering lad of the Manor  (October 05) ; RIP - The Melbourne Cup  (November 05) ; HORSES OF THE YEAR 1861 : A retrospective ?  (November 05) ; Track Bias  (February 04) ; J A P A N E S E* R A C I N G  (March 05) and European Features  (April 02) .
 
Many here assisted with the naming of Forum Floozie, and shared the stories of matings, foals and race day, including the Forum Mascots  (July 02)  many of whom have flown the flag at lofty heights.
 
Plenty of other fun along the way. We've had 5 Punters Clubs through the years, pretty much one for each year, with between 20 to 50 members joining in at different stages. Certainly the highlight result to date has to be "TM The Raven's" bet in July 06, a $34 Quaddie investment (34.4%) which returned a record collect of $2,521.20. Numerous tipping comp's have evolved through the yrs, our longest running Sunday Sunshine , Saturday Tipping and the Weekly Challenge, with numerous other racing and sporting competitions along the way with many forumities being very generous with their time, support and prizes. And, would you believe at we've had over $15,000 travel through the forum bank account, quite amazing when you think it's all trust and cyber relationships !!!!! 
 
There was also the fun and forum interaction through the Spring Comps run by Imaufo through 02 and 03. Cyber auctions, punting, bookies, team strategies, banter and tantrums, we enjoyed it all. And our very own Match Races pitting the great horses and jockeys head to head with your opinion the decider.
 
Many have been happy to meet others from behind the cyber nic, with many successful and entertaining occasions through the yrs, including Hong Kong, Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, Sunshine Coast and Wagga. Friday lunch at the Breakfast Creek for the Straddie weekend has become a regular event for many on the forum.
 
Numerous breeding discussions over the years, from general assistance, mating advice and plans, to new partnerships. A few highligh threads included Super Sire ? Or Octadog  (July 02) ; Statistics to support inbreeding  (July 01) and Who will be the Star 1st Season Sire for 05/06  (February 05) .
 
 
The forum is only what everyone else has made it. Many join in daily, some weekly, some every now and again. Some have been and gone, some have been here since week one. Many contribute in one form or another toward the exchange and enjoyment, many have silently offered to share the load with there own individual efforts. For the manager's it began as some fun, and some months later grew some responsibility, something we endeavoured to respect. It's always been a public forum made up of your contributions, thank you to everyone that has done so.

Offline tontonan

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« 2008-Oct-26, 09:10 PM Reply #7 »
Geez, it was a brilliant forum in its day.  Then look at what it become.
I wonder if it was something particular to that forum, or whether racing forums across the board have gone sour .... except this one of course  :azn:
I was away for 12 months and I was really shocked at how sour all the racing forums had become.   Never have been able to figure it.

Perhaps the ending of MSN Groups will be a blessing in disguise....and cause for some sort of reformation.

I have had a look at Multiply....and it's not going to cut it.

This platform is simply brilliant. 

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 09:21 PM Reply #8 »
Tontonan
Tend to agree, but still you can't make everyone happy all the time.  I just read what I want to read (on all the various forums - horse racing / fishing/ boating / gardening / share market), pity it's not the threads that may give me a winner, but I've always stuck with my own tips, usually for worse  :(  I'm a great fan as are many others of your site, is it a MSN site, if so would love to migrate some of it over to this forum.  You are html savy.

Offline tontonan

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« 2008-Oct-26, 09:43 PM Reply #9 »
Westie,

Your kidding.

I received an email from MSN just yesterday saying that because there had been no action on my MSN Group for 3 months or 6 months or something they were going to delete it !   That's how much attention I have paid to it :p

I live at http://turfology.net76.net/Turfology2/index.htm these days.

Anyway I hit the MSN 'Save My Group' button and they haven't deleted it yet.  You are welcome to any part of it.  Which part do you want ?

Offline westie

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« 2008-Oct-26, 09:50 PM Reply #10 »
None
I was thinking of Racing Central, I remember leaving a message in say G'day.  Top site.

Offline tontonan

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« 2008-Oct-26, 10:02 PM Reply #11 »
Thanks Westie.

Yeah, yeah.  Racing Central is what its called but you would never know by the URL.  That still runs.  It started on MSN Groups but I moved it to a free server as a web site a few months ago.  It functions as my personal punting page these days, and indexes all the Bigpond replays like an online video archive.  Goes good, but only works with IE because I use a lot of inlame frames and Firefox doesn't like them.  I just play around with the web site while I am waiting for the next race.

If there is anything you are interested in on the old Turf Club MSN site you'd better put your hand up because I will be dumping that site soon in light of the recent MSN announcement.

Like Grats I used the MSN platform as a kind of scrapbook and filing cabinet.  Sorry to see them go, but I've moved on.

Offline gratlog

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« 2008-Oct-27, 08:15 AM Reply #12 »
G'day Gents.

A eg of why I gave Triples forum away is a post that I just noticed in their photos of interest thread.  I wonder what sort of people want to post these sort of things.

This type of forum far out does any others imo, only hope that it can be better moderated than TNHRCF.

Offline MagiC~*

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« 2008-Oct-27, 08:20 AM Reply #13 »
This type of forum far out does any others imo, only hope that it can be better moderated than TNHRCF.

This forum has so many more features to moderate threads and posts Grats, another example is the admins can designate moderators for particular boards, they don't have the permissions of the admins, but they do have enough permissions to help moderate the forum,

This also gives the admins the ability to share the work load around, again making moderating the forum much much easier

 :)

Offline woodywob

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« 2008-Oct-27, 07:59 PM Reply #14 »
yes it was a great forum...... and I know why it became a great forum and why it has declined to the crap it is today ...

it became a great forum because of the same reasons Racenet dropped it's forum.

Back then we thought the forum was OURS ..... the people's .... the contributor's ...... the reader's ........

That is why many contributed and spent a lot of time organising and running competitions which got more and more people involved.

Being involved meant that people opened up and expressed their opinion..... that is how discussion starts .....

Management at the time had to do stuff all ........ we the people were coming up with the ideas and discussion topics .....

Management even encouraged a bit of aggro and ill feeling amongst forumites. This I know because they kept sending me emails encouraging me to have a go at people ....

The first part of the decline came when Management abandoned fun and decided that they were to be taken seriously in the racing world. They thought they were more important than what they were. This started with the "Forum Lobby Group".

Management and in particular 777 grew very big heads... thinking the forum was successful through their efforts and that they could have a huge impact on the racing industry..... how delusional were they ?

Well if they were to be taken seriously ...... and why would they be anyway?? ..... they "had" to clean up the forum they thought.

This was the advice they received from the "once a year posters" who had their self interests at heart when complaining about language and forumits who in their opinion would serve their self interests no good ..... management practice this but in a very hypocritical way allowing some things and disallowing others without explanation most times.

How wrong they were in their thinking and in the process they have destroyed what was a great forum ....

It could have been saved when some were calling for Management elections .... a new management team was needed. That was obvious to all except the self servers ....

So it went from being a great forum "owned" by many and happy to be so to 777's forum ..... from then it was doomed.

that's my 20 cents worth .....




Offline gratlog

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« 2008-Oct-27, 08:26 PM Reply #15 »

Yep, makes sense to me.

Hope all is well with you Woody.

This site on multiply (http://multiply.com/mail/updates/gratlog/1)will serve my needs for awhile.  I can post what I want when I want and post links to this forum.
My mates can access it without joining so that suits our punting clubs

Anyone can join and post there but it doesn't really matter.

Remains to be seen what the Gents from TNHRCF do here if they take it over, but will wait and see.
   I see that one bloke on Triples forum who complained about me posting non racing stuff, was tonight posting about buying a car. lol

Offline woodywob

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« 2008-Oct-27, 09:09 PM Reply #16 »
g'day gratlog .... hope all is well with you. I'm having a few health issues atm but apart from that all else is just great ... hope the punt is looking after you ..

Offline MagiC~*

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« 2008-Oct-27, 09:41 PM Reply #17 »
Not sure about what happened at TNHRCF woody,

But I think people need to understand that running a forum and moderating it while keeping everybody happy is near impossible.

I think the only way to do it properly is to lay down guidlines for the forum and be consistant when moderating it and to try and be impartial.

The thing with the msn forum platform, proper moderation is hard because of the facilities available to the people running it, and I think it becomes an us versus you mentality.

So I think it is very important to be impartial and consistant ... and that is one reason I don't want to be moderating it .... not an easy job  :/

Offline Sladey

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« 2008-Nov-13, 02:56 PM Reply #18 »
Woody is fairly spot on, i left that forum ages ago after some of the the piss weak mangement decided to support those who wished to bag & slag off at me and my business and remain anonymous cockheads - to many hidden adgendas with that lot

Offline MagiC~*

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« 2008-Nov-13, 03:45 PM Reply #19 »
Sladey .... we are privileged a fresh new start, and things like personal attacks won't be tolerated along with inappropriate posts and behaviour.

Members, admins and moderators will all be held accountable for their actions with the moderating process being very transparent with posts not being allowed to be deleted by moderators or members ... if a post is inappropriate it will be hidden and a reason will be given, if you don't agree with the reason you can follow up and ask another moderator to see if he or she agrees/disagrees.

Once management have been sorted, we will agree on a set of forum rules and they will be policed very strictly, one of these rules will be no advertising, and no pushing of personal agenda's and no vested interests.

I dare say most will agree with me on most of the above ?

 :)

edit: Above is an example of how the forum will be moderated Sladey  ;)


« Last Edit: 2008-Nov-13, 03:50 PM by MagiC~* »

Offline gratlog

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« 2008-Nov-13, 04:32 PM Reply #20 »
Magic, at the moment I'm a moderator on some threads and was wondering when this changes will I still be able to modify my posts on the Today Racing thread?


Offline MagiC~*

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« 2008-Nov-13, 04:44 PM Reply #21 »
Wait and see what happens in the washup Grats ... but even as it stands now, you are allowed to modify your posts up to 30 mins after first initially posting, so there is allowance there for non-moderators.

Once the new admin is formed then we will add moderators to the boards as you are now to make it easier on all admins, but the decisions on mods will be a group decision also

One thing that will change is that you will not be able to delete any posts or treads ..... this way nobody can just delete somebody else's post for no good reason with out folowing the proper procedures ... will be much more transparent for everybody

 8-)
« Last Edit: 2008-Nov-13, 05:25 PM by MagiC~* »

Offline gratlog

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« 2008-Nov-13, 05:33 PM Reply #22 »
Thanks mate. Be interested to see how it all turns out.


Offline MagiC~*

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« 2008-Nov-13, 05:34 PM Reply #23 »
Thanks mate. Be interested to see how it all turns out.

Hopefully, all for the best Grats ;)

Offline Stormy

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« 2008-Nov-13, 05:38 PM Reply #24 »
Hi Guys,
Just been reading the post.
Which ever way it goes, still will support this forum 100%
If crap happen on this forum they will be hearing from me.
Cheers Stormy. :beer: 8-)


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