Racehorse TALK

Thoroughbred Racing Talk => Racing Talk => Topic started by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 08:04 AM

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 08:04 AM
The following is a report in this morning's Melbourne Herald Sun & Sydney's Daily Telegraph, however to most informed punters Zeljko has been known to us for about fifteen years. It might make interesting reading to those on this forum who have not heard of him.

SOME call him the "Loch Ness Monster", because of his rare public sightings.

Casinos have dubbed him "The Joker".

And he's the mystery man who raids Melbourne every Spring Racing Carnival, and reaps a fortune.

High-profile racing industry figures say he is the biggest punter not only in this country, but in the world.

Meet Australia's most mysterious and elusive gambling figu Zeljko Ranogajec, the man acknowledged even by sources close to the TAB to be, by some margin, its largest punter.

Those who know him well describe him as just a normal bloke.

"If you met him on the street, you would never think he's rich," one relative says. Others describe him similarly as "polite" and "unassuming.
But the size of Mr Ranogajec's betting is far from ordinary. It is believed he accounts for 6 to 8 per cent of Tabcorp's $10 billion Australian betting turnover: $600 million-$800 million, and bets tens of millions more with local bookmakers.

But that's just the start. Once the overseas betting turnover of his 24-hour, seven-day-a-week operation is taken into account, his total annual betting spend globally is believed to be well over $1 billion.

One of Australia's most senior racing figures said Mr Ranogajec was truly a global punter: "He goes wherever he can get set late with big bets. That means countries like Japan, England, Hong Kong, New Zealand and America."

"He had one of his biggest wins of the year on Shocking in last year's Melbourne Cup. So You Think winning the Cox Plate was another big result for him," another source said.

"He bets according to the size of the pools, so the Melbourne Cup would be his biggest betting race of the year.

"If he stopped betting today, Australia's three TABs would be seriously affected, and Betfair (a global betting giant) would be in dire straits. He's that big a player.

"He's the best punter in the world. A guy I know who met him described it best. He said there are seven billion people in the world, four billion of them have probably had a bet at some stage. He's just the one person in the world who is the best punter of them all."

Mr Ranogajec is known to regularly splurge more than $1 million on an individual race, and increases his bets as the prize pool grows.

Industry talk has him employing anything from 30 to more than 100 staff just to analyse form.

The operation has generated plenty of wealth. One relative of Mr Ranogajec from his father's side - who spoke on condition of anonymity - said: "I heard just maybe two or three months ago that he's a multi-billionaire."

Yet he has never been mentioned on any Australian rich list, because the secrecy around his operations means no one is able to estimate his exact wealth.

According to the man himself, the talk about the magnitude of his betting and wealth is all just a big exaggeration.

But in Australia and overseas, any number of racing websites, industry analysts and books indicate he is just being modest and is a global betting giant.

One thing is clear: the 48-year-old has come a long way from his days of being kicked out of Hobart's Wrest Point Casino in the 1980s, as a highly successful young mathematics whiz-kid beating the casino at blackjack by keeping track of each card played (not that there's anything illegal about that).

The relative, from the side of his late father, Mirko, claims he had started to work part-time at Wrest Point while studying for a commerce/law degree.

The relative says he met his wife and "first love", Shelley Wilson, while she was also working there.

But the more successful he became at blackjack, the more his studies started to take a back seat.

His skills as a blackjack player saw him feared by casinos around the world. His business was "politely declined" first at Wrest Point, and Queensland's Jupiters Casino in the mid-1980s. But he did not give up playing the casinos, and moved to greener pastures overseas.

The relative from his father's side recalls him coming home after being too successful on the blackjack tables in the US: "He was in Chicago, I think. They stopped him, and he had to come back."

He increasingly turned his attention to horse racing, as well as other games such as Keno. He once won a then-world record $7.5 million Keno jackpot at Sydney's North Ryde RSL Club in 1994.

He may still have come out ahead because of smaller prizes he collected along the way.

But it is from horse racing that Mr Ranogajec has built his fortune.

Those in the know say the key to Mr Ranogajec's betting is chasing liquidity. He and his associates look for large betting pools awash with "mug punter" money that makes the pool as big as possible.

So private is Mr Ranogajec that there have even been suggestions he is using a pseudonym incorporating his wife's surname. According to records, a John Wilson, born in Hobart with an identical birthdate to Mr Ranogajec and an identical business address, owns a company that has assets including a multi-million-dollar beachfront property on the NSW Central Coast, and a Pacific Highway apartment in St Leonards.

Mr Ranogajec and Ms Wilson have been shrewd investors in property, mainly on Sydney's North Shore. In December 2008, the couple paid $19.75 million for a waterfront property on two blocks at Balmoral Beach, whose value had been hit by the global financial crisis.

The property is in the name of Ms Wilson. Parts of the property had been owned by jailed HIH executives Ray Williams and Brad Cooper.

In the aftermath of the HIH collapse in 2001, the couple had bought another Balmoral property for a knockdown $5.96 million, again in Ms Wilson's name.

  
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: parrapete on 2010-Feb-13, 08:43 AM
From Bubbasmiths's post.

He increasingly turned his attention to horse racing, as well as other games such as Keno. He once won a then-world record $7.5 million Keno jackpot at Sydney's North Ryde RSL Club in 1994.

At that time it was common knowledge in Sydney that the Keno jackpot was set to go off at that club.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 08:51 AM
He knew the jackpot pool was barely increasing after each draw by the amount he was investing on the previous draw, in other words, he knew hardly anybody else was 'chasing' the jackpot and he would probably not have to split the dividend.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2010-Feb-13, 08:57 AM
"He once won a then-world record $7.5 million Keno jackpot at Sydney's North Ryde RSL Club in 1994."

I know nothing about how Keno works.

How much would he have bet?

Did he go up to the window and say "Here's $100,000, I'll have it on numbers 1 2 6 14 etc?
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: ted e turner on 2010-Feb-13, 09:04 AM
put keno with politics...at least your honest jwh unlike your stinking labor comrades :yes:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 09:08 AM
JWH

Yes he was "investing" huge amounts on each draw, fully expecting eventually to get it and also knowing he was the only person with any chance of getting it. If, by chance, he shared it he would have lost.The ultimate gambler.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2010-Feb-13, 09:11 AM
He doesn't mind taking the "unders" either, So You Think in the Cox Plate averaged $9.30 on the TAB's and yet was $12 out to $14 with Bookmakers. I doubt that there has ever been a discrepancy like this in a Group 1 race before.

My records indicate that he also backed Manhattan Rain and Rock Kingdom in that race, which are the two that I was on. Had Manhattan Rain won he would have averaged $13 yet it was $20 all day with the Bookmakers.

Of the last $1.4M that went into the $10.3M total TAB win pools on that Cox Plate as much money went on SYT as went on the 2/1 fav Whobe. My guess is that he had $250k on SYT, $200k on Manhattan Rain and $150k on Rock Kingdom.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 09:25 AM
Grega,
Do not think MORE money was invested on So You Think than Whobegotyou however you might be right in that he is prepared to take 'unders' as in last 54 seconds before betting closed on Supertab $ 33,553 was put on So You Think ( at unders ) and $136,000 put on Whobegotyou.Then again general public might have rallied around the winner as it was trained by JBC.Do not think we can attribute all that money to Zeljko.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 09:35 AM
On further investigation @ 4.30.36 pm $ 21,216 on Supertab
                                 @ 4.30.37 pm $ 23,132 on NSW
                                 @ 4.30.47 pm  $ 24,158  on Unitab

was invested on So You Think just before race. It beggars the question all those bets were placed on the TABs at under the prevailing bookies odds, who would put that one ? Maybe he could not get set with bookies ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2010-Feb-13, 09:40 AM
Great stuff from you guys.  emthup

I think I'll stick to watching videos. :sad:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2010-Feb-13, 09:41 AM
Bubba, nothing to do with JBC as any of that money is on early. Did Manhattan Rain also shorten on the Vic Tab because of Gai?

Nearly half of the last $1.4M invested into the total win pool of $10.3M was his and this $1.4M went on as follows, and as I said as much money went on SYT as the 2/1 fav Whobe.

$300k So You Think
$300k Whobegotyou
$260k Manhattan Rain
$180k Rock Kingdom
$100k Heart of Dreams
$60k Speed Gifted ...............

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: calgary on 2010-Feb-13, 09:43 AM
On further investigation @ 4.30.36 pm $ 21,216 on Supertab
                                 @ 4.30.37 pm $ 23,132 on NSW
                                 @ 4.30.47 pm  $ 24,158  on Unitab

was invested on So You Think just before race. It beggars the question all those bets were placed on the TABs at under the prevailing bookies odds, who would put that one ? Maybe he could not get set with bookies ?

And look how even those amounts are across the 3 tabs - no way that is a random occurence IMHO.  :nowink:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2010-Feb-13, 09:48 AM
Bubba, start your counting from 16.29.39 for STab and NSW Tab and 16.27.15 for Unitab and you will see that I am correct.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: maosanta on 2010-Feb-13, 10:01 AM
They're not necessarily unders when you're getting a massive price advantage (through rebates) over the rest of us mugs.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 10:12 AM
The winner paid an average $9.20 over the 3 TABs he could have $14.00 with bookies. Even allowing for the rebate he would have got on the winner he would have been better off to have backed with the bookies.( providing he could have got on )
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2010-Feb-13, 11:39 AM
I'm sure the syndicate involved in the keno "win" finished well behind.

I doubt the 6% to 8% of turnover in AU tabs - too high methinks.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-13, 12:08 PM
From my memory he only chased the jackpot when it got over $4.5 million, even he invested last $3 million ( net of takeout ) he still finished in front.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Walter Watermelon on 2010-Feb-13, 02:15 PM
I recall when it went off. The RSL club apparently set him up wiyh his own terminal and a hefty rebate. They did pretty well out of it too I believe
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-14, 07:07 AM
Corrections:

Informed punters would have had trouble avoiding Zeljko for the past 25 years.

In no way, shape or form is this an expose. The author couldn't be bothered googling John Wilson, whereupon he would have been able to publicise much information in the public interest.

Now:

This thread has been sidetracked into non-productive Keno speculation. About the only significant relic from that is how Zeljko manages to enjoy Keno kickbacks.

What everyone should be focusing on is how this article keeps affecting them now.

My records show a sobering trend, culminating in these figures for ~7,000 winning Tabcorp divs in 2009:

$8.15 NSW
$7.99 Vic

The 2% underperformance in Victoria is significant, and enough to change go to whoa for sharp punters. And obviously related to the mind-boggling Tasmanian kickbacks.

No one in their right mind should be donating through Supertab.

Yet there is no published evidence that any of these victims have bothered to take the simple wealth hazard avoidance measure of simply betting elsewhere.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: maosanta on 2010-Feb-14, 07:22 AM
JFC, how does Unitab compare to those figures?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-14, 07:33 AM
JFC, how does Unitab compare to those figures?

I don't really want to squander a lot of valuable information that took me considerable effort to compile.

Broadly, UNiTAB is now marginally better than Supertab but still way behind NSW.

This is a recent development. Previously UNiTAB's kickback regime made it the worst for the proletariat.

But the Tasmanian stunt means that it is now the kickback capital. Hence the worst.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2010-Feb-14, 09:01 AM
For Metropolitan races where one of the TAB's pays better than the other two it will be the NSW Tab 43% of the time instead of the expected 33%.

Long may we never see a national pool, and long live the NSW Regulators.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-14, 09:30 AM
One very telling test from my earlier figures:

3,173 NSW > Vic
2,769 Vic < NSW

Now if you run a CHITEST() on those, it reveals that the chance of independence is a staggeringly low figure of much less than 2 in a million!

This tremendous outlier is consistent with my impression that pool manipulation has been going on for a very long time.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2010-Feb-14, 09:41 AM

Industry talk has him employing anything from 30 to more than 100 staff just to analyse form.


He employs significantly in excess of 100 people in his operation. Australian racing is only a small part of it.

Doesnt bet with bookmakers because he believes he can get a better return at the end of the year dripfeeding on tote rather than knocking off a price and the "followers" further denting TAB dividends.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-14, 09:59 AM
Antitab

I was quoting the newspaper article, personally, I have no idea how many people Z might employ.

JFC

You are correct, personally I came across "Team Zeljko " on tracks throughout Victoria & NSW in the mid 1980's however, as I posted, I doubt as to whether he was publicly known to the majority of informed punters until about 15 years ago.
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2010-Feb-14, 10:09 AM
Sorry I should have changed the quote name.

As I have mentioned previously I have worked for him for over 6 years and all though I have never met him or seen him it is good work.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2010-Feb-14, 10:45 AM
Anitab wrote..
"As I have mentioned previously I have worked for him for over 6 years and all though I have never met him or seen him it is good work."

Bit like the CEO of BHP Billiton has not meet the Victorian Sales Director  :lol:   :lol:   :lol:   :lol:  
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: maosanta on 2010-Feb-14, 10:52 AM
I don't really want to squander a lot of valuable information that took me considerable effort to compile.

Broadly, UNiTAB is now marginally better than Supertab but still way behind NSW.

This is a recent development. Previously UNiTAB's kickback regime made it the worst for the proletariat.

But the Tasmanian stunt means that it is now the kickback capital. Hence the worst.


The reason I asked is because Unitab is giving some people 11% rebates through their "offshore" associates.  The biggest loser in that arrangement is the qld racing industry which gets zero product fees from so-called international customers.  The harness industry in qld is on to the rort.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-14, 11:15 AM
The reason I asked is because Unitab is giving some people 11% rebates through their "offshore" associates.  The biggest loser in that arrangement is the qld racing industry which gets zero product fees from so-called international customers.  The harness industry in qld is on to the rort.

Without pretending to justify or even understand the UNiTAB arrangement, I believe a key difference is the UNiTAB offers are available to far, far more people than the very few that enjoy the Tasmanian or Tabcorp privileges.

I believe those deals are so severely structured that literally(?) only a handful of Australian outfits could qualify for meaningful benefits.

Leaving that handful to control the market.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Aussie Bricklayer on 2010-Feb-14, 11:51 AM
I very much doubt that Zeljko Ranogajec and his syndicate make any money out of their betting part of their operations on the Australian TABs these day, If they do still play, they are more likely to just play for the kickbacks. The landscape of the Australian TABs has changed considerably in recent years, because of corporate bookmakers betting tote odds. Stability of tote dividends is long gone.

I have been reliably informed that Antitab used to do the form for Jeljko on the American races, but no longer works for them as they have given up betting on the American races.

Who was the idiot who suggested Jeljko had $250,000 on So You Think in the Cox Plate at average odds of $10.00, when $15.00 was available with bookmakers. Winning at the races is really about securing best odds.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dragons on 2010-Feb-14, 11:55 AM
Why would tabcorp give him 2 floors in their building if he wasn't turning over a fortune on Australian racing?
You are kidding.He bets everywhere.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Aussie Bricklayer on 2010-Feb-14, 12:30 PM
Dragons

Don't believe everything you read or hear, do the maths.

Every horse in every race at some point during betting is at a better price with Bookmakers or Betfair than the best closing price on the three totes, so where is the advantage in win betting on the TABs. As for exotics, Trifecta and Quinella pools have been in decline for many years. Also Quinella and Trifecta dividends generally reflect the closing totes on each TAB, resulting in no real value there anymore.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dragons on 2010-Feb-14, 12:42 PM
Aussie please.
I know what i am talking about, he is getting rebates off the Tab's and if you are refuting what he does you have no idea of the facts.
In fact many pros i know now just want to turnover x amount and are even happy to break square and get the 6% rebate which many pros consider as a reasonable figure.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Aussie Bricklayer on 2010-Feb-14, 12:48 PM
Dragons

Why would tabcorp give him 2 floors in their building.

Why would Jeljko need two floors in their building, all it would take to place a bet(s) would be a push of a button on a computer, that's doing the maths.

Dragon, your appear to agree with me, he not winning on the punting, just living off the turnover kickbacks.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dragons on 2010-Feb-14, 12:59 PM
Aussie he needs two floors at tabcorp because he employs a large number of video watchers and form analysts who are doing videos from all over the world.
I never said he wasn't winning but the rebates are an added incentive.
You telling me you wouldn't like 6% kickback on turnover regardless if you are winning or breaking square.
You obviously have no idea what you are talking about if you don't know he has got two floors at tabcorp.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arakaan on 2010-Feb-14, 01:09 PM
ok we get it. you all know everything their is to know about this secretive man and you all have big penises.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Fastnet Rock on 2010-Feb-14, 01:14 PM
ok we get it. you all know everything their is to know about this secretive man and you all have big penises.
 :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2010-Feb-14, 01:48 PM
What surprises me is he does his betting on form.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Mercs2 on 2010-Feb-14, 02:32 PM
I very much doubt that Zeljko Ranogajec and his syndicate make any money out of their betting part of their operations on the Australian TABs these day, If they do still play, they are more likely to just play for the kickbacks. The landscape of the Australian TABs has changed considerably in recent years, because of corporate bookmakers betting tote odds. Stability of tote dividends is long gone.

I have been reliably informed that Antitab used to do the form for Jeljko on the American races, but no longer works for them as they have given up betting on the American races.

Who was the idiot who suggested Jeljko had $250,000 on So You Think in the Cox Plate at average odds of $10.00, when $15.00 was available with bookmakers. Winning at the races is really about securing best odds.

Pretty unlikely  that any of the corporates would let him on, isn't it ?

At a guess, I'd say he's barred everywhere and can only get on at Betfair or the TAB's.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: value on 2010-Feb-14, 02:58 PM

My records show a sobering trend, culminating in these figures for ~7,000 winning Tabcorp divs in 2009:

$8.15 NSW
$7.99 Vic

The 2% underperformance in Victoria is significant, and enough to change go to whoa for sharp punters. And obviously related to the mind-boggling Tasmanian kickbacks.


JFC, Are these win only or exotics as well? Would the exotics be even worse?

I think the article is fairly accurate (or a different version with Murdoch inc.) As it says they have the top floor of the "fox sports" building and they still do US racing. Not sure who owns the "tabcorp" building.
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-14, 03:16 PM
JFC, Are these win only or exotics as well? Would the exotics be even worse?

I think the article is fairly accurate (or a different version with Murdoch inc.) As it says they have the top floor of the "fox sports" building and they still do US racing. Not sure who owns the "tabcorp" building.
 

Those figures are just for the Win.

I'm not in a position to provide detailed figures for Exotics, but as a considered rule of thumb:

You should find either that NSW overperforms in certain Exotics, or matches Vic in others.

But Victoria never outperforms NSW!

So anyone taking them on Supertab should consider switching to NSW.

I don't detect any glaring inaccuracies in the article - apart from suggesting the kickback not exceeding 4%. The problem is the glaring omissions that could have been rectified with basic googling.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: pitsoftheworld on 2010-Feb-14, 07:05 PM
jfc

have you done any analysis of multis / exotics - NSW vs VIC

i get the feeling that the quaddies are still better on VicTab ?

agree though that Z is a rebates guy on auusie racing - is happy to beak even on the punt on UniTab (via Vanuatu and Norfolk Island) and via Tassie on VicTab

Z is still a major player in HK and Japan also  where its a bit tougher - you need to get your figures right in those jusrisdictions
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: maosanta on 2010-Feb-14, 07:46 PM
Wasn't he originally partners with Alan Woods?   I heard they went there separate ways a long time ago.  Should have got easier since AW passed away.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-15, 04:34 AM
jfc

have you done any analysis of multis / exotics - NSW vs VIC

i get the feeling that the quaddies are still better on VicTab ?

agree though that Z is a rebates guy on auusie racing - is happy to beak even on the punt on UniTab (via Vanuatu and Norfolk Island) and via Tassie on VicTab

Z is still a major player in HK and Japan also  where its a bit tougher - you need to get your figures right in those jusrisdictions

Apparently some crossed lines, as I thought I'd just addressed the Exotics question.

But if you review my CHITEST() figures along with the frequencies offered by Greg, this should reveal a certain pattern.

It appears that someone with high-speed last-second access (not to mention) kickbacks is orchestrating the pools so as to optimise kickback-adjusted returns.

If they go to that much trouble to not leave a crumb for anyone else, it is naive to imagine they would leave a backdoor for us mugs via Exotics.

Note however that Tasmania does not mingle into every Supertab pool, so that's a further factor to consider.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2010-Feb-15, 06:09 AM

I have been reliably informed that Antitab used to do the form for Jeljko on the American races, but no longer works for them as they have given up betting on the American races.



You must have the wrong guy. Dont do American races and still employed unless you know something I dont.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-15, 07:29 AM
Wasn't he originally partners with Alan Woods?   I heard they went there separate ways a long time ago.  Should have got easier since AW passed away.

Woods informed us all that his health issues left him unable to leave his penthouse for more than a few hours. Then he mentioned operating in 50 countries. Suggesting he was in cahoots with someone.

Maybe there are actually two outfits cutting each others' throats in 50 countries, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Skybeau on 2010-Feb-15, 08:01 AM
Was Alan Woods eraser on the old forum ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: triple7 on 2010-Feb-15, 08:43 AM
no
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2010-Feb-15, 08:55 AM
Entropy
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: 7out on 2010-Feb-15, 09:00 AM
I don't really want to squander a lot of valuable information that took me considerable effort to compile.

Broadly, UNiTAB is now marginally better than Supertab but still way behind NSW.

This is a recent development. Previously UNiTAB's kickback regime made it the worst for the proletariat.

But the Tasmanian stunt means that it is now the kickback capital. Hence the worst.


Hi JFC

I have just sent you a private message.

Cheers
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-16, 05:02 AM
Here is some more readily available information that our journalistic sleuths appear incapable of uncovering.


http://www.mansard.act.gov.Au/HANSARD/1997/Pd's/19971209.PD

http://www.Vanuatu.USP.ac.DJ/sol_adobe_documents/USP%20only/Vanuatu/Foss en.PD

(Try searching for VITAB to cut to the chase).

Curious.

You would think that a nexus between Waterhouses, Bob Hawker, Saint Gianna, Seljuk Timur Reengage and SP bookmakers that redirected funding away from schools, hospitals and the racing industry might be considered newsworthy.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-16, 07:54 AM
Here's the gist of one incident mentioned in Fossen's research report:

Vanuatu granted 3 tote licences to:

Allan Tripp - convicted numerous times of illegal SP betting.

Christopher Chung - convicted for importing prostitutes, and exporting contaminated seafood.

VITAB - beneficiary ownership unfathomable - run by Peter Bartholomew, Tripp's brother in law.


Chung cut a kickback deal with VicTAB.

VITAB's 11% owner Hawke cut a kickback deal with ACTTAB.
VITAB's 20% owner and biggest customer was Zeljko plus sidekick.

When the ACT parliament kyboshed the scam, VITAB sued, and ACT taxpayers forked out over $3 million to settle.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-16, 08:00 AM

You would think that a nexus between Waterhouses, Bob Hawker, Saint Gianna, Seljuk Timur Reengage and SP bookmakers that redirected funding away from schools, hospitals and the racing industry might be considered newsworthy.


With so much defamatory material flourishing here, you've decided to censor names from a Hansard Report!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-16, 03:13 PM
I trust some of you are enjoying the parallel debate at the Betfair forum.

Don't worry. I expect normal service will resume here eventually.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2010-Feb-16, 03:24 PM
I get the feeling you don't like Zeljko?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-16, 03:48 PM
I get the feeling you don't like Zeljko?

I'd love to tell you about my feelings, but I fear that would be in breach of the forum T&C.

However I'm prepared to volunteer that one thing I don't like is our journalistic sleuths' jaundice.

They have gone to extraordinary lengths to keep mum about pertinent facts such as the VITAB scandal, and a few more I could mention.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2010-Feb-16, 04:04 PM
The story in the papers was a 'feelgood' story of a man who has beaten the odds in the punting game and made a fortune.
It is not a bad thing for the industry as a whole to have stories of hope in the paper, keeps the mugs thinking they can do it too.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-18, 08:44 AM
The story in the papers was a 'feelgood' story of a man who has beaten the odds in the punting game and made a fortune.
It is not a bad thing for the industry as a whole to have stories of hope in the paper, keeps the mugs thinking they can do it too.


Robert James Lee Hawke:

"I have found them honourable and decent and competent men with whom to deal ... as distinct from
some of these loose lipped politicians around the place who want to cast aspersions at least on Mr
Bartholomew, all I can say is I have found him an honourable, decent, intelligent and competent
man."

Yet Peter James Bartholomew was a convicted criminal mentioned in the Costigan Report!


http://www.hansard.act.gov.au/hansard/1994/pdfs/19940615.pdf

Hardly makes me "feel good" .
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2010-Feb-18, 10:23 AM
Any thread on ZR brings some interesting posters out of the woodwork, a couple of first time posters in 7out and value, and a couple of idiots in The Aussie Bricklayer (TAB for short) and me apparently.  :)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: ted e turner on 2010-Feb-18, 10:26 AM
 :wacko:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2010-Feb-19, 08:45 AM
An intriguing personality in the VITAB debacle is Daniel Kolomanski.

http://www.crispinhull.com.au/1994/08/08/1994_08_august_kolo/

Apparently very lucky in lotteries.

Also his persuasiveness has nor deserted him over the years, as he now appears to be very much in the thick of major property redevelopments in Melbourne.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2010-Feb-28, 01:54 PM
How does Paul Makin rank with Zeljko, does he punt in a similar fashion, the few article that have talked about his punting suggest he may do ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: value on 2010-Feb-28, 10:37 PM
According to Alan Woods- Paul Makin 'persuaded' an employee to come over and work for him and bring across a version of the software. Paul Makin says 'he can't lose' on the USA races (similar track sizes, surfaces) he bets on. Of course the Woods, Zeljko analysis has the same origin but I believe Humbleton has progressed a lot more in recent years. So as far as I know Makin is US only.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2010-Mar-01, 12:51 PM


It seems that Australia has produced some of the best and most succesful 'punters' in the world ever.
I guess we really are the lucky country  :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Jan-22, 10:44 AM
Apparently Zeljko has just been inducted to the Blackjack Hall of Fame.

http://blog.ub.com/2011/01/2011-blackjack-ball-hollywood-dave/

Seems to have ruffled some feathers at relevant forums.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Ed on 2011-Jan-22, 02:38 PM
Theres an article in today's Weekend Australian Magazine about Tasmanian-born artlover David Walsh, whose backround sounds remarkably similar to that described here. :whistle:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Walter Watermelon on 2011-Jan-22, 02:45 PM
What is about Tasmanians. The extra finger a plus?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2011-Jan-22, 02:45 PM
Ed

There's a whole thread hereabouts titled Citizen Walsh.

If I knew how to I'd link it here. :blush:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Ed on 2011-Jan-22, 04:13 PM
Ah ha, found it. Maybe he should include an actual TAB oulet, replete with punters, as an installation piece in MONA to show where the funds came from.   :lol:  
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Jan-25, 11:10 AM
Apparently Zeljko has just been inducted to the Blackjack Hall of Fame.

http://blog.ub.com/2011/01/2011-blackjack-ball-hollywood-dave/

Seems to have ruffled some feathers at relevant forums.



This discussion questions the merits of Zeljko's induction, even suggesting that this is somehow related to some investment in Barona - the Native American Californian Casino connected to Rubin where this Hall resides.


http://www.blackjackinfo.com/bb/showthread.php?t=12677&page=2

That seems entirely plausible to me.

Zeljko has made a number of subtle forays into controlling Casinos and Totes, while refusing to undergo a probity check.

However, perhaps emboldened by New York's inability to detect his role in the VITAB fraud, he is successfully reinventing himself, enabling him to cut himself an even bigger slice of your presumed wealth.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Jan-27, 10:14 AM
Here are some further insights into Zeljko's syndicate.

Poker champion David Steicke and vigneron Ray Gatt.

The first time I've seen them publicly named.

http://www.puntersparadise.com.au/forum/dataprocessors-services_7560/

http://kingtipping.com/forum/racing-programs_7385/

http://www.dataprocessors.com.au/Contact.html

http://www.edensprings.com.au/news/index.htm

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Beachy on 2011-Jan-27, 10:22 AM
No doubt they're involved though from some of the stuff I've seen ...
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Entropy on 2011-Feb-01, 05:10 PM
Other syndicate members a Phillip turner, George Mamacas  and David walsh
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-01, 05:53 PM
Other syndicate members a Phillip turner, George Mamacas  and David walsh


As mentioned before on this thread, David Walsh already has a guernsey here.

Evidently Mamacas is a poker player. If not a restaraunteur.

Philip Turner is about as googleable as John Wilson. But might have some poker associations.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Entropy on 2011-Feb-01, 06:18 PM
All 3 along with Z and Woods started out card counting at wrest point in the late 70s - early Eighties
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Feb-01, 10:07 PM
WOW!
So now the syndicate has expanded  :o
I thought Zeljko(or as The Aussie Bricklayer wants to spell Jeljko- hmmm  :chin:) was the only one.
What is the count now??
I wonder what would happen if one of the syndicate died?

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Entropy on 2011-Feb-02, 11:11 AM
Most of them have had a share since 86/87 when they first went national.
and here i have to digress:
jfc is on the right track, one needs to ask the right questions the fact is that these individuals have an unfair advantage over the rest of us they can crush a markets advantage to 0% and less yet still make money thanks to the kickback on the Tassie Tote while the rest of us are left with nothing this has happened for too long, people need to start complaining and writing letters asking WHY? now thats one thing these guys dont want.
If there is anything you can do to help your punting career "write that letter".
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-Feb-02, 02:17 PM
Wasn't he originally partners with Alan Woods?   I heard they went there separate ways a long time ago.  Should have got easier since AW passed away.

Alan was partners with Bill Benter in HK & they did go their separate ways. Don't remember Alan being in cahoots with ZR at any stage.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-Feb-02, 02:19 PM
Was Alan Woods eraser on the old forum ?

Now that's hilarious. Eraser is a fair punter but not in Alans league. He did work for him once upon a time though. It wouldn't surprise me if he still lurks around these forums.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-Feb-02, 02:22 PM
All 3 along with Z and Woods started out card counting at wrest point in the late 70s - early Eighties

I'm sure you don't mean at the same time. ZR would have been a young boy when Alan was counting cards.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-02, 03:06 PM
Alan was partners with Bill Benter in HK & they did go their separate ways. Don't remember Alan being in cahoots with ZR at any stage.


Hold on.

Alan Woods was on record as betting in 50 countries, coincidentally Zeljko's figure.

Do you honestly believe these hobby punters were operating independently and in competition with each other?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-02, 03:43 PM
I'm sure you don't mean at the same time. ZR would have been a young boy when Alan was counting cards.

Zeljko could have legally played in a casino in 1979.

Fits in with Entropy's time frame.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Feb-02, 08:55 PM

Hold on.

Alan Woods was on record as betting in 50 countries, coincidentally Zeljko's figure.Do you honestly believe these hobby punters were operating independently and in competition with each other?

Where did you get Zeljko's figures from?
Pretty sure you didn't get them from him.
For the record I dont see the difference.

Why, jfc, have you not mentioned the fact that corporate bookies, other punters and even TAB owned co's are getting the same rebates your nemisis is?
Please explain???
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-02, 10:27 PM
Where was Woods on record as saying he was betting in 50 countries?

Have you stopped taking your medication, jfc?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 06:27 AM
Where did you get Zeljko's figures from?
Pretty sure you didn't get them from him.
For the record I dont see the difference.



Evidently you don't see any difference whether or not I got Zeljko's figures from him.

So why are you asking me about something that makes no difference to you!

What gibberish!

You know I will shoot you down in flames if you ask a coherent question.

So your cunning plan is to resort to incoherence.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2011-Feb-03, 07:23 AM
Zjelco doenst bet in anywhere near 50 countries.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 07:53 AM
Zjelco doenst bet in anywhere near 50 countries.


But Alan Woods claimed to?

Considering Zeljko is acknowledged as the biggest, that doesn't seem to add up.

I just realised that I bet into around that number of countries. Not that hard to do.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 08:24 AM
Quote
But Alan Woods claimed to?

Where did he claim to bet in 50 countries, JFC?

Please provide the source of this info as it is on record.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 08:34 AM
Where did he claim to bet in 50 countries, JFC?

Please provide the source of this info as it is on record.



Buried somewhere in the Ausrace list.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 08:38 AM
Please provide the source, Ausrace is easy enough to search.

Most of what you write here is pure fantasy on your part.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 08:42 AM
Please provide the source, Ausrace is easy enough to search.

Most of what you write here is pure fantasy on your part.

It is actually very hard to search.

And just like DJH you probably don't care about  the answer, but are just trying to create mischief.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 08:51 AM
Quote
It is actually very hard to search.
And just like DJH you probably don't care about  the answer, but are just trying to create mischief.

I am not trying to create mischief, I am calling you out on your BS.

Put up or shut up JFC.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 09:31 AM
I am not trying to create mischief, I am calling you out on your BS.

Put up or shut up JFC.


It's too late to deny your trolling intentions once you've completely exposed them.

If your enquiry was genuine, why add the mindless "medication" barb?

Why claim searching Ausrace is easy, when it is one of the most cumbersome sites around?

And why claim most of my writings are pure fantasy, when I have provided an abundant amount of public material about Zeljko here? Including Hansard, law cases, academic studies, probity checks. Most of which our official media has been unable to find.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 09:41 AM
You're the troll around here JFC.

Put up or shut up.  Post the source of your claim that Woods is on record as stating that he is betting in 50 countries.  If not perhaps you could post a retraction.

Surely someone with such an unhealthy obssession with these individuals as you would have this information, if it were true (which it isn't) at hand?

If you insist on posting unsubstantiated BS which is a figment of your imagination, don't be surprised if you get called out on it.

My enquiry is genuine and I know the answer.

Shoot me down in flames if you would.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2011-Feb-03, 09:55 AM

I just realised that I bet into around that number of countries. Not that hard to do.


I suspect it is hard to do and even harder if you want to win in all of them.

Which 50 countries do you bet in?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 10:02 AM
I suspect it is hard to do and even harder if you want to win in all of them.
Which 50 countries do you bet in?

Of course it's hard to do.

Perhaps JFC could run through the turnover and takeout figures for all the countries listed here and advise us which countries he bets in.

http://www.horseracingintfed.com/wageringDisplay.asp?section=4

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-Feb-03, 10:04 AM
http://www.asianracing.nu/vb/search.php?searchid=122969&pp=25&page=20

There are five years of Alans posts on here if you have time to go through them all. I doubt you will find any reference to betting in 50 countries. His radar was mostly on HK.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 10:10 AM
I suspect it is hard to do and even harder if you want to win in all of them.

Which 50 countries do you bet in?

Just a bit of whimsy on my part.

Some sports have circuits spanning that many countries.

But even in just horse racing there are some indicators that seem to be country-independent. And seem to work long-term.

But obviously if I blabbed that here, it would be :

"See you later,
indicator"

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-Feb-03, 11:50 AM
Well here ya go. There is a tie in with ZR.

http://www.asianracing.nu/vb/showthread.php?p=15986#post15986
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-03, 03:31 PM
You're the troll around here JFC.

Put up or shut up.  Post the source of your claim that Woods is on record as stating that he is betting in 50 countries.  If not perhaps you could post a retraction.

Surely someone with such an unhealthy obssession with these individuals as you would have this information, if it were true (which it isn't) at hand?

If you insist on posting unsubstantiated BS which is a figment of your imagination, don't be surprised if you get called out on it.

My enquiry is genuine and I know the answer.

Shoot me down in flames if you would.


I don't know if there is a more specific post out there, but at least this one contains enough to infer that Woods was betting in many countries.

Why would he be betting in the highest raking country around, if he hadn't tried all the better ones first?

His ownership of Betfair and assessment of Zeljko are noteworthy, making it reasonable to assume they were pooling their resources.

http://ausrace.com/archives/2007-June/054396.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2011-Feb-03, 09:22 PM
making it reasonable to assume they were pooling their resources.

More whimsy on your part, JFC?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-04, 01:30 PM
Well here ya go. There is a tie in with ZR.

http://www.asianracing.nu/vb/showthread.php?p=15986#post15986



That certainly is a fascinating link, filling in some key developments for me.

After reading it again, another old "hang on, this does not compute" sentiment surfaced.

What does Woods mean by:

"i tried to stop it but it was like a tidal wave "

If you are simply betting on a fixed soccer match how can you be affected by a tidal wave?

But if Saint Alan was running an illegal sports book, then that's one explanation.
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-04, 02:12 PM
Now as to the match in question, judge for yourself:

http://footballfanaticos.blogspot.com/2010/04/greatest-world-cup-matches-cameroon.html

Judge for yourself.

To me it looks like the Cameroon keeper Songo keeps avoiding the ball.

Maybe another profession would be more suitable. Hopefully his kick back from that rigged match will assist.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: assumethecrown on 2011-Feb-04, 11:42 PM
If you cant beat them, join them...

Interesting book on match fixing in sport:

http://www.howtofixasoccergame.com/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-05, 01:42 PM
If you cant beat them, join them...

Interesting book on match fixing in sport:

http://www.howtofixasoccergame.com/


And of course the great bonus in rigging sports is that you can be immortalised glowingly on film by Robert Redford or (as is happening as I write on 9) Omar Sharif.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Feb-05, 10:31 PM
jfc,
I would have thought someone who bets in around 50 countries and deems himself worthy of rebates equivalent to the elite would have better things to do at 1:42pm on a Saturday than be researching and posting on a chat room???
After all, you were too busy to find a Betfair bonus "amongst your 5ooo page statement"  :confused1:\
I can only assume your staff and apparently innefective computer(which isn't actually innefective- mearly being ripped off by a sole punter who is NOW part of a syndicate) were taking care of things  :whistle:

Maybve if you spent Saturdays working rather than checking youtube you might have less of an issue with Zeljko and crew?

BTW, You still haven't answered my question as to why you are only concernrd with Z's rebates and not the numerous other punters and corporates etc that receive them???
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-06, 08:58 AM
jfc,
I would have thought someone who bets in around 50 countries and deems himself worthy of rebates equivalent to the elite would have better things to do at 1:42pm on a Saturday than be researching and posting on a chat room???
After all, you were too busy to find a Betfair bonus "amongst youR5ooo page statement"  :confused1:\
I can only assume your staff and apparently innefective computer(which isn't actually innefective- mearly being ripped off by a sole punter who is NOW part of a syndicate) were taking care of things  :whistle:

Maybve if you spent Saturdays working rather than checking youtube you might have less of an issue with Zeljko and crew?

BTW, You still haven't answered my question as to why you are only concernrd with Z's rebates and not the numerous other punters and corporates etc that receive them???


Instead of learning from your last set of blunders you press on again with more garbage.

Even after I explained, you are too dense to realise that many sports bettors bet on the same group of players that travel around a 50-country circuit. So associating such a commonplace practice with some Saturday working edict is nonsense.

First you wonder how I could be posting on a Saturday, then immediately provide two dumb answers yourself.

What an insane waste of everyone's time. You have no business with such impertinence in the first place.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Gintara on 2011-Feb-06, 09:19 AM
Even after I explained, you are too dense to realise that many sports bettors bet on the same group of players that travel around a 50-country circuit

that's a bit of a stretch isn't it to use that as an example of betting in 50 countries  :/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-06, 09:36 AM
that's a bit of a stretch isn't it to use that as an example of betting in 50 countries  :/

As I already explained.

It was a joke, Jintara.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Feb-14, 05:57 PM
http://forum.thoroughbredvillage.com.au/the-worlds-best-punter_topic22801_page1.html

There is some interesting material about Zeljko here.

The specific material appears credible to me.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-May-05, 06:08 AM
Rather amusing homage to Zeljko on this site:

http://klingpost.com/world-biggest-gamblers/

But remember.

If it's on the Internet it must be true.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-May-05, 10:14 AM
If that old bloke in the photo is Zeljko he certainly has not "aged well".  :lol:   :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arthur on 2011-May-05, 10:48 AM
Close photo-finishes will do that to the best of us  :blink: :sad:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-May-05, 11:24 AM
That is Alan in that photo with some of his birds.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-May-05, 03:20 PM
Man those pics are a joke. That young guy is not Akio Kashiwagi. He's not even Japanese FFS.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-May-05, 04:09 PM
Man those pics are a joke. That young guy is not Akio Kashiwagi. He's not even Japanese FFS.


you sound like quite an intriguing bird. Presumably with a blackjack and/or HK background.

Is there anything you are at liberty to volunteer about (say) the post Woods era?

Like to whom did his estate go, and who's assumed his operations.

Or any general observations about how the HK betting scene is evolving now that it has been graced with the presence of Mark Read.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2011-May-06, 09:26 AM
Not me mate. I can't offer anything other than Alan had kids so I presume they have been looked after. My connection with Alan died with him.  I didn't even know Read was in HK.

Interesting to see that the pic of Alan has now been replaced by the pic of Z form TBV. Someone on here has been in their ear? No?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-May-06, 09:33 AM


Interesting to see that the pic of Alan has now been replaced by the pic of Z form TBV. Someone on here has been in their ear? No?

  :lol:   :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Sep-06, 06:31 PM
I'm sure you don't mean at the same time. ZR would have been a young boy when Alan was counting cards.


In the interests of nailing the facts:

Various articles have Alan Woods moving to card counting in 1979.

When Zeljko would have been 18 and thus finally entitled to bet legally.

Woods mentioned encountering Zeljko at around that time, so Entropy's assessments have conviction.

Tony Wilson's article has Woods running a counting team by 1982, so it would be interesting to know whether Zeljko or the others were participants.

Unfortunately Wilson declines to disclose which one of that team relieved Woods of his then recent second wife.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Oct-31, 06:51 AM
As alleged earlier, the core group is/was:

Zeljko Ranogajec
David Walsh
Ray Gatt
David Steicke

There is an interest disclosure about Steicke he

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/sa/SASC/2010/188.html

I caution everyone to pay strict attention to the suppression order aspect outlined there, before injudiciously shooting off their mouse.

Anyway the fascinating facts are the legal costs incurred by then:

$10.5 million +
$26 million

And this matter appears far from settled!

Heartwarming to learn more about how gains from the Tote Tasmania kickbacks are put to use.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Nov-19, 04:51 PM
It's an apt time to consider this allegation about Zeljko owning Typhoon Gaming.

http://www.puntingace.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9316

However note that the author Stebbo is an exposed troll who among other crimes enjoys hacking into others' accounts. Obviously he isn't that credible, and any of you who comtemplate having anything to do with him should not complain when your computer gets infected with a worm, or your account balance gets adjusted South.

Anyway I'll be interested if anyone can verify the Typhoon allegation.

Zeljko has a track record of trying to buy into gaming companies. And refusing to undergo the required probity checks. And thanks to some incompetent gumshoes conducting such checks he seems to have succeeded a number of times.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Gintara on 2011-Nov-19, 06:04 PM
That thread is over a year old  :chin:

Why do you let it bother you jfc  :what:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Nov-19, 06:28 PM
That thread is over a year old  :chin:

Why do you let it bother you jfc  :what:

The reasons are obvious. Although the Tabcorp-vested media prefers to adopt the Horatio Nelson/three wise monkeys sleuthing attitude.

Perhaps anyone whose penny hasn't dropped might be illuminated here in the near future.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Gintara on 2011-Nov-19, 06:59 PM
Really?

I would have though it be more positive to worry about what you do that continually worry about what others are up to  :chin:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Nov-19, 07:33 PM
Really?

I would have though it be more positive to worry about what you do that continually worry about what others are up to  :chin:


Of course.

When both parties are competing legally on that mythical level playing field.

But one party is on record as being the principal beneficiary of the VITAB fraud, and consequently depriving first Canberra now Tasmania of hospitals, schools and other essential social services. We taxpayers are left to foot the bill while he dupes the ATO into ruling his multinational enterprise is a recreational hobby.

That same party goes the Waterhouse route of persuading the media to reinvent him.

And maybe, just maybe, there may be even saucier material that's off the record.

I defy anyone here to find a more positive gift than I have developed he

Avoid Zeljko-contaminated Supertab to boost your returns by over 10%. For some the difference between red and green.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Nov-19, 09:29 PM

Of course.

When both parties are competing legally on that mythical level playing field.

But one party is on record as being the principal beneficiary of the VITAB fraud, and consequently depriving first Canberra now Tasmania of hospitals, schools and other essential social services. We taxpayers are left to foot the bill while he dupes the ATO into ruling his multinational enterprise is a recreational hobby.

That same party goes the Waterhouse route of persuading the media to reinvent him.

And maybe, just maybe, there may be even saucier material that's off the record.

I defy anyone here to find a more positive gift than I have developed he

I apologise if I have missed something as it is late, but what is your "positive gift"


EDIT: I do apologise.
I missed the last line!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rumpelstiltskin on 2011-Nov-20, 08:13 AM
tax laws are there to be manipulated, working in with big operators like the tab is business.  big players will always have an edge. that's life.  :dry:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: usernametaken on 2011-Nov-20, 09:55 AM
Posted by: Rumpelstiltskin
Insert Quote
tax laws are there to be manipulated, working in with big operators like the tab is business.  big players will always have an edge. that's life.

Don't make it right though!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rumpelstiltskin on 2011-Nov-20, 11:16 AM
no, it doesn't make it right. but its the way it is and always will be. most politicians feather their own nest or there thrown out.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Baker on 2011-Nov-20, 06:36 PM
User

Have you taken a look at a website called "kangaroocourtofaustralia.com.au". If what he says isn't true then he would be getting he arse sued off, so just goes to show you how corrupt our judicial and political system is, so I say rob and cheat the system wherever you can, because Julia Gillard has done just that and millions of imbecilces voted for her and she is our Prime Minister. Now that is what I call not right and not fair.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: usernametaken on 2011-Nov-21, 05:38 AM
Thought we lived in a democracy. The majority decides.
The way I see it is, (quickly protects head waiting for volley of blows) we all have to pay tax or the the whole country grinds to a halt. But perhaps I am just another mug who "resides" in the earning bracket where ALL politicians of ALL persuasions do their best to keep us there, as we are carrying the whole place.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Baker on 2011-Nov-21, 09:22 AM
User

You are exactly right in what you have said. We just keep getting screwed and if you try to change it, you will get beaten down.

We all live in hope that we will own the next Black Caviar  :no1:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Wenona on 2011-Nov-21, 12:20 PM

We all live in hope that we will own the next Black Caviar  :no1:

I'd even be happy to live long enough to see someone else own it, I'd be about 327 I reckon.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-14, 09:04 AM
http://www.peepsplace.com/showthread.php?p=690002

More cute insights into Zeljko's operations and aspirations.

The author seemed to have a conversation with Alan Woods and has inadvertently talked out of school.

It seems to confirm some of my conclusions posted here.

Like Schreck being on Zeljko's payroll  in the raid on New York.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-24, 06:03 AM
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/treasury/taxman-targets-the-king-of-punters-zeljko-ranogajec/story-fn59nsif-1226229779154

Never sighted at racetracks?

Never given an interview?

Wealth accelerated by Keno!!!!!!!

I better stop before my composure lapses over some of the more outlandish tales that follow.

Funny how the VITAB fraud mentioned in Hansard has completely eluded these sleuths.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2011-Dec-24, 08:04 AM
All,

Zeljko may become the first person ( officially anyway ) to be taxed because he 'punts like a bookmaker' in that by various methods he virtually eliminates the risk of loss from his activities which, importantly, are conducted on a large scale in a systematic way using computers ( various old tidbits of case law come into play here ).

Now the main way the taxman may get him is the habit of both backing and laying the same horse(s). Of course the various contractual relationships over rebates will help to snare him too. Note that the taxman has chosen to essentially leave him alone while he was not laying horses.... I warned forumites elsewhere that laying horses would see you squarely in the ATO's sights  AND give them a clear 'point of difference' from existing case law to find your profits taxable.

They might as well start at the top to get their precedent. I have yet to make a single lay bet as I knew this day would come. When you think about it 'trading' in other arenas is taxable so a little common sense.... goes a long way.

On the other hand the ATO might not find his activities taxable..... but I doubt it.

Walsh is quoted as saying no one has been found taxable so far.... I think thats rubbish. Some have even chosen to be taxed.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2011-Dec-24, 08:08 AM
It will be interesting.

It is my understanding The ATO have left horse punters alone since the Ross Evans case in the 80's. However with virtually no cash transactions now there is a much more defined audit trail so the ATO would seem to have a much better chance than they did previously.

http://www.plungers.com.au/plungers-articles/1991/3/1/betting-without-tax-you-should-be-so-lucky/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rodent on 2011-Dec-24, 08:43 AM
It simply comes down to whether or not Z is deemed to be in the "business" of punting. If he has employees, wouldn't this be enough? Doesn't he own Humbleton?
 To say a punter who lays horses is in the business of punting is a stretch. Some you like hence you back, some you don't, you lay.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2011-Dec-24, 08:57 AM
Rodent,

It's a lot more sophisticated than that!

Zelkjo, himself, has provided evidence to the ATO that he has both backed and layed the same horse in a race ( he was defending himself about laying horses to lose during an inquiry ) and that no matter the result he was covered. In essence he has shafted himself on the bigger picture IF the media article is accurate in what it says.

Rodent how far down the totem pole any precedent goes to others remains to be seen. We are years away from any final court decision if such shoud happen.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-Dec-24, 10:41 AM
Fours wrote..."Walsh is quoted as saying no one has been found taxable so far.... I think thats rubbish. Some have even chosen to be taxed."

Spot on Fours.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rodent on 2011-Dec-24, 11:07 AM
To be fair, "no one has been found to be taxable" is still accurate. Choosing to be taxed or declaring your punting to be business activity for tax purposes is a different thing. The ATO of course will be happy to take your tax $ but it is a different thing to win a court case and force you to pay.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-Dec-24, 11:17 AM
According to today's Weekend Australian Tabcorp's NSW building in Ultimo is the registered address of some of Zeljko's businesses including Minefield Investments, Paziti Holdings & Raxson Pty Ltd. If any of those businesses engage in any form of wagering and/or have any commercial agreements in place with Tabcorp in exchange for betting turnover, any profits they might make would without any doubt be subject to federal taxation because any business entity, by its very nature, is set up to make a profit and is therefore subject to taxation.
Surprisingly there is no mention in the paper about Humbleton Pty Ltd , company set up by Zeljko sometime ago, which "specialises in the provision of value added data  for thoroughbred, harness and greyhound racing", whatever that "value added data " means !!!!.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-24, 11:22 AM
To be fair, "no one has been found to be taxable" is still accurate. Choosing to be taxed or declaring your punting to be business activity for tax purposes is a different thing. The ATO of course will be happy to take your tax $ but it is a different thing to win a court case and force you to pay.

Not only is it inaccurate, Walsh is being as disingenuous as a newt with its pants on fire.

As others here have verified elsewhere, punters have been found to be taxable.

As I understand it Ross Evans and Peter Babka in their separate cases escaped paying tax.

But Tony Boyd paid up to the ATO.

Boyd appeared to be a sole operator.

Certainly a stark contrast to Zeljko and his multinational business employing hundreds - as we've been told.

Furthermore the reported kickbacks are so obscene that they turn Zeljko's caper into a risk-free experience.  And that takes it away from the concept of gambling.







Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-Dec-24, 11:29 AM
Rodent

Some years ago in SA, a punter was declared liable for taxation on his winnings. He did not challenge the assessment or appeal the assessement in any court. In the end the ATO sent him broke. I am unsure whether he wanted to fight them in court but he just accepted that he should have paid tax and sadly left it at that.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2011-Dec-24, 11:40 AM
jfc

How both Evans & Babka were able to pull the wool over the judges' eyes always had me puzzled, but for Walsh & Ranogajec to pull the same stunt would be beyond belief.

If they have not already not paid tax, albeit minimal, in a myriad of company structures that would put the Murdoch family to shame, I would be staggered. If they have not, I reckon they are in a bit of trouble with their AUSTRALlAN assets.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-25, 06:45 AM
http://ausrace.com/pipermail/ausrace/2009-February/subject.html#6802

http://ausrace.com/pipermail/ausrace/2009-February/006802.html

(some navigation initiatives may be required)

This earlier debate about ATO issues may be of interest.

Note that I do not necessarily concur with all those opinions.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: innerwiz on 2011-Dec-25, 05:13 PM
I think we can tell who isn't making money on the punt.

It's the one's calling for taxation of others.

For if they were making money, they wouldn't be so vocal.   Despite what they say in other threads.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-25, 06:23 PM

It's the one's




Congratulations on pushing the extremities of apostrophe abuse.

Most offenders are content with one error.

But you pack two into a two syllable expression!

http://www.apostrophe.org.uk/

But even if you removed all grammatical errors from your post, it would still be nonsense.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: innerwiz on 2011-Dec-25, 06:35 PM
Maybe if you spent more time analysing horses and not apostrophes.

More time not getting jealous of those that have succeeded.

You might have more success at what matters.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2011-Dec-25, 07:02 PM

Congratulations on pushing the extremities of apostrophe abuse.

Most offenders are content with one error.

But you pack two into a two syllable expression!

http://www.apostrophe.org.uk/

But even if you removed all grammatical errors from your post, it would still be nonsense.



I see only one error.

Maybe counting ain't your long suit. :bulb:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-25, 07:09 PM
I see only one error.

Maybe counting ain't your long suit. :bulb:

Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Skybeau on 2011-Dec-25, 07:10 PM
Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.




You come off as a real arrogant  :censored:  jfc. 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2011-Dec-25, 07:17 PM
Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.




Well I plead guilty to stupidity however the only excuse for not seeing two must be a drink or three.

So show me the two.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Gintara on 2011-Dec-25, 07:25 PM
English wasn't my strong suit at school but I could only find one.  :shy:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2011-Dec-25, 07:27 PM
I see two.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2011-Dec-25, 07:47 PM
Of course there's just one. ;)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2011-Dec-25, 07:56 PM
Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arakaan on 2011-Dec-25, 08:34 PM
Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.


This right here is the funniest post ever. JFC trolling himself. That's comedy gold.   :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-26, 05:46 AM

This right here is the funniest post ever. JFC trolling himself. That's comedy gold.    :lol:  


A truly bounteous Saturnalia when Arakaan slithers in for sacrificial slaughter.

Soon after I first arrived here he disclosed his underwhelming hand. But in this caper it's hard to reshuffle, making it particularly painful for those like him who are not playing with the full deck.

If JWesleyHarding wanted to legitimately challenge me he could could have done so by clearly arguing his position.

But not only does he pointedly decline that option, he instead demands to be shown.

As more people see my initial post, they will be left in no doubt as to what I consider the two errors are. Hence his demand is nonsensical and further testifies to his stupidity.

So he has already lost.

Back to Arakaan.

Clearly pointing out another's stupidity is not trolling yourself.

It will be amusing to see if actually tries to justify his position. But even if he now tries to lay low this gaffe will continue to bite him.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2011-Dec-26, 06:30 AM
It was you, jfc, who chose the apostrophe as the battleground with your over-the-top reaction to a rather innocuous post by innerwiz.

And you made a goose of yourself.

No harm done, no one died.

I'd suggest we let the spostrophe's rest in peace while you get back to doing what you do best.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arakaan on 2011-Dec-26, 08:28 AM
It just gets better. Please keep it going JFC.

A Saturnalia Carol.

JFC as Ebenezer Scrooge.
Alan Woods as the Ghost of Saturnalia past.
Zeljko Ranogajec as the Ghost of Saturnalia present.
Andrew Black as the Ghost of Saturnalia yet to come.

After being visited by the 3 ghosts of Saturnalia JFC decides they are all thieves and that as always, he agrees profusely with himself that he is in fact the greatest human being to ever walk on the planet earth.

A heartwarming tale for all the family.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: calgary on 2011-Dec-26, 03:10 PM
  :lol:  Gold!   emthup
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-26, 04:20 PM
According to today's Weekend Australian Tabcorp's NSW building in Ultimo is the registered address of some of Zeljko's businesses including Minefield Investments, Paziti Holdings & Raxson Pty Ltd. If any of those businesses engage in any form of wagering and/or have any commercial agreements in place with Tabcorp in exchange for betting turnover, any profits they might make would without any doubt be subject to federal taxation because any business entity, by its very nature, is set up to make a profit and is therefore subject to taxation.
Surprisingly there is no mention in the paper about Humbleton Pty Ltd , company set up by Zeljko sometime ago, which "specialises in the provision of value added data  for thoroughbred, harness and greyhound racing", whatever that "value added data " means !!!!.


http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/sinodisp/au/cases/cth/FMCA/2009/9.html?query=palicave

This case which the media insists on overlooking seems to resolve the question of whether Zeljko owns any companies in the business of punting.

Zeljko's Palicave clearly fits that bill.

Particularly when considering it was suing O'Farrell for non-payment of discretionary kickbacks.

The paragraph exploring the discretionary nature of the arrangement remains as one of my favourite segments of absurdist literature.


"I accept that Mr O’Farrell thereby incurred a very significant debt to  Palicave . I also accept from Mr O’Farrell’s evidence that his capacity to repay the debt was substantially dependent upon the Wilson syndicate remaining an active customer of Capital Play by wagering large amounts of money in horse racing and other events which Capital Play took bets on internationally. Further, I accept from the evidence of Mr Wilson that the willingness of Mr Wilson’s betting syndicate to continue betting large sums with Capital Play in turn depended upon the “loyalty payments” made by Capital Play for their customers. Mr O’Farrell gave evidence that the loyalty payments were discretionary but the accounts of Capital Play put in evidence[6] establish that they were treated in the company accounts as a liability. In any event, I accept from Mr Wilson’s evidence that the willingness of the syndicate to “bet big” depended upon the loyalty payments being made which offset losses on unsuccessful bets.

It appears to me that a certain amount of slight of hand was involved between the parties here. I accept Mr O’Farrell’s evidence that his company’s contracts with US racing tracks would have been voided if he had entered into a legally binding agreement to pay rebates other than discretionary loyalty payments. Therefore, the payments had to appear to be discretionary.

Nevertheless, there must have been some form of agreement or understanding between (on Mr Wilson’s evidence which I accept) the betting syndicate and Capital Play that loyalty payments would be made because the betting syndicate made most of its profit from those payments and the syndicate would not continue to bet if it lost money."
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Dec-26, 11:55 PM
Actually you see at least two.

But you are too stupid to realise.

And even stupider to advertise your stupidity with your post.



If only you had left the milk and cookies out    :unsu
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2011-Dec-27, 10:19 PM
Oh, between you and I jfc, nothing significant will come of YOUR audit  :no:
Certainly nothing taxation wise anyway.
Z and co run their operations very efficiently.
How are you travelling, jfc?

I am pretty certain an audit is low on your list of priorities atm.
Much more to worry about I would suspect, given current events  :shrug:

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2011-Dec-28, 06:31 AM
"He is responsible for more than $650m, or 8 per cent, of the annual turnover from Victorian and NSW-rooted company Tabcorp. That figure does not include Tote Tasmania, which is soon to be absorbed into Tatts' betting pools, with which he also conducts business and which control TAB betting in Queensland, South Australia and the Northern Territory."

That paragraph is saturated with garbage.

Tasmania offers the biggest kickbacks therefore you would expect Zeljko to bet more in Tasmania than with Tabcorp. But it is virtually impossible for him to turnover more than $650m there.

Wonder who informed the authors of these figures? If it was Tabcorp then Max Presnell must feel feel victimised after Tabcorp's non-cooperation in his famous expose of "J" from Poland. If not, then how would others know?

Interesting how an entity can be "rooted" in two places, and wonder why Tabcorp is not also rooted in the Northen Territory where it operates Luxbet? And will it still be rooted in these places if gets rooted by losing a licence tender?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: betupbob on 2011-Dec-29, 07:24 AM
The Australian

Treasury
Taxman targets the king of punters Zeljko Ranogajec

    by: Brendan Cormick and Cameron Stewart
    From: The Australian
    December 24, 2011 12:00AM

 


24/12/11 Zeljko Ranogajec

Zeljko Ranogajec enjoying a walk around Balmoral in Sydney. Pictu Craig Greenhill Source: The Australian

AUSTRALIA'S biggest gambler, a reclusive maths wiz who bets more than $1 billion each year, is being examined by the Australian Taxation Office.

Tasmanian-born Zeljko Ranogajec accounts for between 6 and 8 per cent of Tabcorp's $10bn Australian betting turnover and is said by experts to be the world's biggest punter.

Now, the mysterious son of Croatian immigrants faces an ATO audit, according to his business partner and fellow gambler David Walsh.

Ranogajec recently helped fund Walsh's dream of building Hobart's newest tourist drawcard, the $70 million Museum of Old and New Art and Walsh says he feels deeply indebted to his former university colleague.

"He is being audited (by the tax office) at the moment but I am sure it will turn out amicably," Walsh tells The Weekend Australian.

"Does he owe them money? I suspect he reckons he doesn't and they reckon he does."
Tile2_28DayPass

Walsh says he and Ranogajec have discussed the audit, which he says is due to be completed by next September.

"The assumption that he owes them money depends on the assumption that gambling is taxable and that has never happened in Australia," Walsh says.

"At this stage no gambler in Australian history has ever been taxable."

The Weekend Australian understands that the ATO has asked Ranogajec for financial records going back seven years. Ranogajec, who is in Europe with his wife and daughter, did not respond to questions from The Weekend Australian and the ATO declined to comment, citing privacy provisions.

A man never spotted at racetracks or casinos, Ranogajec defies the image of the traditional flamboyant punter from the rich history of Australian thoroughbred racing. They wore expensive suits, had flash cars and dined at the best restaurants. They had names like "Hollywood" George Edser, the "Prince of Punters" Perc Galea, the "Filipino Fireball" Felipe Ysmael and Eddie "The Fireman" Birchley.

Ego drove them and, for some, was their downfall.

Not so Ranogajec. He has been dubbed the "Loch Ness Monster", simply because he is so rarely seen. Rivalled on the world stage only by a couple of Hong Kong's betting syndicates, he is the exact opposite of his punting rivals.

He is reclusive, loathes media attention and demands discretion from his employees and information and service providers.

He and his wife, Shelley Wilson, own properties across Australia including a $20m, 2000sq m waterfront property on two blocks at Sydney's Balmoral Beach.

Ranogajec is also believed to use the pseudonym John Wilson.

He has never granted an interview and has been nominated by racing websites as probably the world's biggest punter. A senior wagering source estimated the man known among the gambling elite simply by his Christian name, invests as much as $3bn across numerous international markets where pari mutuel (tote) systems operate, including the US, France, Britain and Hong Kong.

Besides horse racing, he bets on sport, lotteries and the stockmarket. Ranogajec has spent millions of dollars trying to find a legal way to "beat" lotto and has studied the stockmarket, looking for behavioural patterns and ways to manipulate share prices to his advantage under certain conditions.

In Australia, he bets on every thoroughbred race. There is no racing on Good Friday or Christmas Day, though you can bet a major race meeting in Japan tomorrow will not have escaped his attention.

Hundreds of bets are queued up in the TAB system and are placed in the final seconds as horses fill the barrier stalls, so that opportunistic betters cannot follow the money as the odds tumble. Win and place bets may fit into his repertoire, but the big money is in the exotics - trifectas (1st, 2nd, 3rd), quartets (the first four placegetters) and quaddies (the winners of four nominated races). These types of bets offer big pools and opportunities for big payouts.

At the major carnivals, when there is a lot of "mug money" wagered by uninformed and once-a-year punters, the rewards for Ranogajec are at their highest. A source at One Tote Tasmania said a file detailing his betting activities one Melbourne Cup Day was "an inch thick".

Betting on horses is not a perfect science. When champion mare Makybe Diva was preparing to win an unprecedented third Melbourne Cup in 2005, Ranogajec bet against her, laying her over an extended period leading up to the morning of the race. Trainer Lee Freedman threatened not to start Makybe Diva if the track was presented like a bitumen road. The Victoria Racing Club's ground staff watered the track enough to ensure it would remain forgiving in the warm conditions.

Makybe Diva duly ran and won. Ranogajec endured a loss that amounted to double figures with six zeroes on the end.

He has been known to diversify his gambling to include even scratch-and-win tickets. One anecdote relates to a company, keen to market a new theme with their scratchy tickets, getting in touch with Ranogajec. It was explained that a portion of the tickets had been sold, though tens of thousands remained and nobody had come forward with the major prize winning ticket and therefore it must be in the remainder.

Ranogajec bought them and paid someone to scratch the opaque covering off all the tickets. At the end of the exercise, it became evident that the winning ticket had been sold to a customer at a shop, who had discarded it, not realising it was a winner.

One bookmaking identity said Ranogajec could walk through Melbourne's Bourke Street Mall and nobody would recognise him or look at him twice.

He is known to bookmakers but is too big and too frequently successful for them to entertain his business.

He is responsible for more than $650m, or 8 per cent, of the annual turnover from Victorian and NSW-rooted company Tabcorp. That figure does not include Tote Tasmania, which is soon to be absorbed into Tatts' betting pools, with which he also conducts business and which control TAB betting in Queensland, South Australia and the Northern Territory.

Wagering outlets have courted Ranogajec with rebates of between 6 and 10 per cent on his turnover. He is betting exchange Betfair's biggest antipodean client, thought to be responsible for a third of the company's Australian operations.

Racing stewards have had, on rare occasions, the need to query his betting activities, but have never had suspicion of corrupt activity. In fact, they say he appears to have no connection with jockeys or trainers. The only thing that got him into strife punting was his cardcounting ability, which, although not illegal, saw him barred from gambling on blackjack tables at every casino in Australia.

One steward said his panel queried wagers on a horse to lose on Betfair, but Ranogajec produced proof that he had backed the same horse to win with TAB. The dividends were such that no matter whether the horse won or lost, Ranogajec had more than covered his outlay.

The 49-year-old has amassed his personal wealth from gambling, accelerated by a $7.5m Keno jackpot. He was a formidable blackjack player and began to accumulate his fortune at Wrest Point Casino. He joined forces with Walsh and two others at the University of Tasmania to develop the gambling empire. One of them died when accidentally run over by a car. Walsh is the only member of the group that remains involved with Ranogajec.

The key to Ranogajec's success is often said to be a slender profit margin. Another industry figure, who did not wish to be named, says: "If anybody tells you that you can't win on the punt, he (Ranogajec) is proof that you can."

Working on an annual turnover said to be $1bn, he grosses $10m for every 1 per cent of profit. One high-profile individual engaged an actuary to replicate Ranogajec's model, but to no avail and he eventually gave up.

Speaking to The Weekend Australian, one close observer of Ranogajec's business yesterday debunked that theory, saying that, with attractive rebates, it was possible to break even on a series of bets and profit close to 10 per cent with the rebate alone. When he gets a race "right" the profit can be as high as 15 per cent.

Walsh says he has been mates with Ranogajec for more than 30 years.

"I met him at Wrest Point which was then Australia's only casino," he says. "We weren't particularly serious about gambling. The casino was quite near the university and it was a fun thing to do. It was very much a recreational pastime."

Walsh says they enjoyed gambling as a hobby and, using the logic of probability, they began to prove that they could win.

"The confluence of enjoying gambling and being able to win meant we did more of it," he says. "It's what I still do today and it takes up the majority of my time.

"The difference between winning and losing is knife-edged. It can be a tiny percentage, so it is an interesting thing to try to figure out that percentage.

"There is nothing particularly profound about this. We've been successful but the rules are simple and there are a million books that tell you how to do it. You just need to know what the odds are."

Walsh says that Ranogajec has never had a run-in with the law over his gambling.

"And there is absolutely no reason why he should have," he says. "The way we gamble is completely at a stand off from the event."

Walsh says the industry is "better off" for the money that people such as Ranogajec pump into it.

The Weekend Australian visited Ranogajec's double-fronted property in Mosman. A neighbour said they had never seen him there. A tenant in another Mosman property belonging to the Ranogajecs had not heard of him. Ranogajec's wife is the landlord.

A lavish home on Coronation Avenue, Mosman - possibly the Ranogajecs' primary residence - was bought for $5.96m in a dispersal of assets of Brad Cooper, a central figure in the HIH scandal.

Level 3, 495 Harris Street in Sydney's Ultimo - the building that houses Tabcorp's NSW regional office - is the registered address of some of Ranogajec's businesses, including Minefield Investments, Paziti Holdings and Razson Pty Ltd.

According to one insider who spoke to The Weekend Australian, Ranogajec has left Australia to live in England. He says the move allows the mega-punter to better control his global operation from a central location.

Walsh confirms Ranogajec is in Europe with his family "looking for betting opportunities".

'He won't be back for awhile," he says.

Additional reporting: Anthony
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-02, 10:20 AM
More amusing hallucinations from the cloaca press - who can't even bother hacking his mobile to get closer to the truth:

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/cashpoint/view/232289/The-world-s-biggest-gamblers-and-their-best-bets/

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Feb-11, 02:48 PM
In this weekend's edition of The Australian Financial Review ( AFR ) there is a two and half page story on Z. According to the AFR, the Australian Taxation Office is again looking into Z's affairs. Apparently Z told associates that the ATO are demanding about $900 million  for 10 years back taxes, penalties & interest. :unsu In a recent  court case in which Z sued an associate Z was very keen to impress on the court that his syndicate was '"not a business" :what:. In his words , it was a "punter's club" or just a "collection of individuals" who came together for a bet. As the ATF says that modest description does no justice to the scale of his operation that employs 300 people in Hobart & Sydney and runs a global gambling operation that places bets on races in Japan, Hong Kong, England, Australia and the US.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-11, 04:57 PM
Quotes Tatts Group CEO Dick McIlwain as scathing of Tote Tasmania's strategy.

Kickbacks estimated as 10.5%.

$45 million last year.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/the_gambler_GwoSmf5IXaVFjmpyYXNu9J
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Feb-11, 05:19 PM
Let's hope CEO of Tatts follows up that statement and shuts down ANY offshore agency that co mingles with Tatts pools, otherwise it is a hollow statement.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-Feb-11, 11:19 PM
  :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Feb-12, 07:49 AM
In the article The Tatts CEO  claims that the rebates are robbing money from other punters. Can someone please explain this to me?

Other than backing the odds on favourite a place as Vo has highlighted (which is a drop in the ocean as a percentage of rebates paid) there is no effect on the average punter, it is only Tote Tas's profitability that is being hurt.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rodent on 2012-Feb-12, 08:11 AM
With rebates being offered Z can bet to even smaller margins. Any time Z is encouraged to bet, it is bad news for the rest of us. Those of us who win would certainly win more if he weren't around.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Feb-12, 10:27 AM
Antitab

On threads titled  "Tote Tasmania" and/or "Tabcorp"it has been clearly explained how other punters are robbed by those punters receiving rebates.Those most affected are those who show a profit on their punting , whilst those punters who consistently lose, are less affected.
I suggest you troll through those threads and you will soon be enlightened. 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Feb-12, 10:35 AM
 ATO tax claim of $900 million on Z

I imagine this is an ambit claim by the ATO and it will be settled out of court OR it will go all the way to the High Court, which will run on for years. It is of interest that Z now resides in the UK, who according to his partner David Walsh, " to seek further gambling opportunities " :rolleyes:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-12, 03:30 PM
In the article The Tatts CEO  claims that the rebates are robbing money from other punters. Can someone please explain this to me?

Other than backing the odds on favourite a place as Vo has highlighted (which is a drop in the ocean as a percentage of rebates paid) there is no effect on the average punter, it is only Tote Tas's profitability that is being hurt.


This is but one of a number of ways that all other punters are affected.

It is black and white. And mentioned often before.

The Tote Tasmania Annual Report clearly reveals that other Supertab members are underpaid by $69 million!

In effect, the others are receiving $69 million less than their statutory entitlements!

What more outrageous impost on punters could anyone want!

But that is far from the end of the story.

Were that $69 million to be rightfully returned, I believe that money would be reinvested over and over, until 100% of that $69 million ends up shared by the industry, wagering operators and government.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: value on 2012-Feb-13, 05:22 PM
Grega9430 and others do a good job of explaining things here in the topics "Rebates" and "The TAB Rebate Rort".

http://www.racehorsetalk.com.au/index.php/topic,12668.0.html

http://www.racehorsetalk.com.au/index.php/topic,11504.msg230720.html#msg230720
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: 22 WOOBIA 22 on 2012-Feb-13, 07:58 PM
JFC are you saying that had Z Not bet at all the racing, Punters and clubs would be better off.

I would have thought that if he had not bet that the figure would Not be 69m.

Can you go Sllooowww and explain how this works.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-14, 06:55 AM
Before trying to respond to WOOBIA, consider this never before revealed outrage:

Victorian Tote Last FY:

$607 million = Maximum commission legally allowed

$634 million = Actual commission received by Tabcorp


$27 million = Illegal commission!


How on earth can anyone argue those punters aren't worse off!

Why have Wilkie Xenophon and Costello for once kept silent!

Why didn't the AFR reveal this!

Why didn't Tabcorp inform shareholders of this significant phenomenon!


Note that while the above figures leave no room for doubt, it takes considerable effort to extract and compile them from intentionally misinformative documents.

Here are the sources.

Knock yourself out!

http://nettab.custhelp.com/ci/fattach/get/13854/

http://www.australianracingboard.com.au/uploadimg/factbook2011.pdf

http://www.tabcorp.com.au/resources.ashx/mediareleaseschilddatadocuments/727/FileName/0ACD6E6AE4C8179A41590EBF60B638A2/Slide_presentation_to_analysts_by_Chief_Executive_Officer.pdf
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Feb-14, 07:33 AM
As a Tabcorp shareholder I look forward to asking a few questions at the next AGM. Anyone else likely to come along for moral support ? Colonus ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-14, 05:29 PM
Interesting allegations from Ruth.

She's probably unaware of recent developments.

http://www.puntersparadise.com.au/forum/Zeljko-Ranogajec---the-ATO-catches-up_10632/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-15, 08:15 AM
JFC are you saying that had Z Not bet at all the racing, Punters and clubs would be better off.

I would have thought that if he had not bet that the figure would Not be 69m.

Can you go Sllooowww and explain how this works.


Presumably no one now still disputes that punters are currently being shafted by the Tote Tasmania ramifactions.

Now, speculating about what would happen if Zeljko didn't bet is moot.

He will bet into Supertab irrespective of kickbacks. Because he will never deprive his competitors the pleasure of his absence.

His turnover would drop but who cares. It's the revenue that counts.

Now, if anyone wants to argue that overall industry revenue will drop, then back your arguments with factual material, or face the consequences.

I've given you enough links.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Feb-17, 07:02 AM
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/horseracing/with-angels-you-never-dare-to-punt-20120216-1tbf7.html

I recall a 2KY interview between Max and TJ, after the former had questioned the latter's wrap of R S Dye.

TJ opened with "You calling me senile?".

An apt question for anyone who relies on Punting Ace  information for Zeljko.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rumpelstiltskin on 2012-Feb-25, 07:23 AM
http://aussiecriminals.wordpress.com/2012/02/24/punters-around-australia-read-this-con-you-may-never-bet-again/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Mar-04, 12:57 PM
http://www.australianracinggreyhound.com/australian-greyhound-racing/greyhound-betting-australian-greyhound-racing/horse-manure-sometimes-useful-but-not-when-you-tread-in-it/32302

This prompted me to read some more articles by the author.

Leaving me in no doubt that Bruce Teague has an undisclosed agenda.

Consider this gem:

"Nominally, any effect on other customers is negligible."

First, I defy anyone to find any way in which "nominally" is valid there.

Then, how can he be oblivious to the $69 million effect that the AFR article (which he borrows, but fails to credit) mentions? The same sum that I have been expounding here for some years.

No competent informed person can deny that Zeljko's 3 decades of dubious stunts have had an enormous detrimental effect on all honest punters.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Sunliner on 2012-Mar-05, 07:10 AM
JFC, Bruce sells historical data etc to people wanting to try and make money betting on the dogs.

Its his belief that the TABs, raceclubs etc should invest money in this class of punter, and he fails to understand the concept that 'winning punters' do not in practice pay for their wagering, but instead fund their wagering by forcing a faster loss rate for the 'mug punters'.

I tried to explain to him the concept of profitless turnover, and gave him examples of how the professional wagering companies treat 'winning punters, from their barring by the Corps, to Betfairs Premium Charge, but he persists in the belief that because everyone is charged the same fee before the race, then they are paying their way. Winning punters are in effect competing with the wagering providers and the codes for the money to be won.

The bookies name escapes me, he was one of the legends of the 60's, 70's, but the 2nd best bit of advice I ever got when I started bookmaking was "dont aim to be the biggest holder, aim to be the biggest winner".

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: ledgerr77 on 2012-Mar-06, 11:35 AM
 :chin: sunliner what was best advice given to u ?????? given that no.2 was pretty damn good !!!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arthur on 2012-Mar-06, 12:21 PM
Don't pi$$ into the wind  :stop:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Sunliner on 2012-Mar-06, 03:46 PM
Best advice.  :no1:

"odds-on favs were invented so bookies could get rich"    :clap2:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: usernametaken on 2012-Mar-06, 06:09 PM
Best advice I ever got was from my old man on my 16th birthday.

"Son, if you aren't in bed by 12 o'clock you may as well come home"    :biggrin:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: iggypop on 2012-Mar-06, 08:28 PM
jfc, sorry to be late to the party on the zeljko wrap, but aren't you also a pretty good pro punter and haven't you managed to get a rebate too?  What is it that separates him from all the others getting rebates.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-Mar-08, 10:45 PM
jfc, sorry to be late to the party on the zeljko wrap, but aren't you also a pretty good pro punter and haven't you managed to get a rebate too?  What is it that separates him from all the others getting rebates.

jfc, wherefore art though??
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Mar-11, 05:55 AM
jfc, wherefore art though??




Duh
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2012-Mar-11, 07:26 AM
Iggy Pop won at Newcastle yesterday.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: iggypop on 2012-Mar-13, 09:40 AM
jfc, it would seem I'm not smart enough to understand the message in yuor clips!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Arsenal on 2012-Apr-02, 07:21 PM
This might be old news but there's a story in the court case I expect.....if located I'll post the link. :beer:

http://afr.com/p/national/the_gambler_GwoSmf5IXaVFjmpyYXNu9J
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Apr-02, 07:26 PM
This might be old news but there's a story in the court case I expect.....if located I'll post the link. :beer:

http://afr.com/p/national/the_gambler_GwoSmf5IXaVFjmpyYXNu9J

http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/sinodisp/au/cases/cth/FMCA/2009/9.html?query=palicave

Sure I've posted this before.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Apr-13, 06:55 AM
I'm sure the syndicate involved in the keno "win" finished well behind.

I doubt the 6% to 8% of turnover in AU tabs - too high methinks.


Turns out you were dead wrong about the kickbacks.

The expression "double-digit kickbacks" has now entered the industry vernacular.

And you've also been proven wrong here about other aspects of Zeljko's modus operandi.

So all your continuing attacks on my credibility achieve is portray you as an ungracious loser.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Apr-13, 07:08 AM
JFC there is some massive problems/errors with your continued attacks on Z.

First and foremost is that he is not the only one receiving kickbacks and he didnt make the decision to pay himself the rebate. Those that sign the cheques returning the money should be the targets of your scorn.

Secondly the syndicate Z is part of  operates profitabley in many other parts of the world where there are no rebates. You come accross as very jealous.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: luvtheponies on 2012-Apr-14, 05:00 AM

Turns out you were dead wrong about the kickbacks.

The expression "double-digit kickbacks" has now entered the industry vernacular.

And you've also been proven wrong here about other aspects of Zeljko's modus operandi.

So all your continuing attacks on my credibility achieve is portray you as an ungracious loser.

Very difficult to attack something that doesn't exist jfc.

Can you please fill me in our your credibility.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Apr-14, 05:29 AM
Very difficult to attack something that doesn't exist jfc.

Can you please fill me in our your credibility.

That has been abundantly documented here.

Seek and ye shall find.

And if you've recently come out of a coma, or whatever, perhaps you should try to catch up on pertinent developments first, before passing judgement.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-12, 07:31 AM
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/zeljko-loch-ness-monster-ranogajec-moves-overseas-taking-his-estimated-1-billion-a-year-betting-away-from-australian-tabs/story-e6freoof-1226353336228



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-May-12, 11:30 AM
Does anyone really believe by relocating to an overseas tax haven, Z will no longer bet on Australian races ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-May-12, 09:13 PM
.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-May-12, 09:41 PM
All,

Laying of horses and arbitrage activities ( let alone rebate negotiations with various TABS ) mean that 'it's a business' is a slam dunk. A clear pointof dference to earlier court decisions, and tax rulings, can be readily shown.

If you want to act like a bookmaker you should not be surprised to be taxed like one.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-14, 11:05 AM
All,

Laying of horses ........... mean that 'it's a business' is a slam dunk.
.....
If you want to act like a bookmaker you should not be surprised to be taxed like one.

Fours
Rubbish!

Laying contingencies is identical to backing their complement.

Furthermore Betfair Laying differs from established bookmaking in that markets are extremely close to 100%.

For example EPL 2013 is currently 100.5%!

A Layer of favourites there is begging for annihilation.

If the ATO was deranged enough to tax Layers then it would immediately find a phenomenal number of Layers manufacturing losses.

Very easy to do and can be made impossible to detect or prove.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-May-14, 12:21 PM
jfc,

Snipping out parts of my sentence is not a valid way of arguing. I expect more from you!

You also disappointed by suggesting that margins are relevant to taxation. Coles and Woolies at 2% POT get taxed just like those bsinesses on 200% POT.

Fours

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-May-14, 12:26 PM
If the ATO proceed I suspect Zjelko will lose as he is clearly running a business.

However more people lose on the punt than win. Therefore the ATO/gov  will lose if punting is considered a business as all the losers can claim to be running a business and claim all their losses. The tax deductions for losers will be more than the tax they receive from winners. It is for that reason that the ATO have always put punting income in the to hard basket.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-May-14, 12:39 PM
Antitab,

You are talking more sense BUT a 'point of differenc' between the likes of Z and other layers is easily established.

I'll nominate employees but one can name many things alone, or together, to make the point of difference from the mass of losing punters and keep the revenue safe.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2012-May-14, 12:47 PM
If the ATO proceed I suspect Zjelko will lose as he is clearly running a business.

However more people lose on the punt than win. Therefore the ATO/gov  will lose if punting is considered a business as all the losers can claim to be running a business and claim all their losses. The tax deductions for losers will be more than the tax they receive from winners. It is for that reason that the ATO have always put punting income in the to hard basket.

Wouldn't the ATO be able to differentiate between a business and a hobby punter just as they do with breeders ?

If you only own a small number of mare or noncommercial mare I am pretty sure you can not claim any right offs. Could the ATO do something similar with professional punters ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-May-14, 01:15 PM
If you claim to do 60 hours a week studying form, and treat it in a professsional manner  the ATO arent in a position to dispute it. Plenty of business lose money and their owners claim tax deductions we might be able to see the flood gates opened for punters.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-14, 01:27 PM
jfc,

Snipping out parts of my sentence is not a valid way of arguing. I expect more from you!

You also disappointed by suggesting that margins are relevant to taxation. Coles and Woolies at 2% POT get taxed just like those bsinesses on 200% POT.

Fours




My clear intent was to focus specifically on the "Laying" aspect of your post. Thus my snipping was proper and even laudable.

Now I note Woolworth's last reported HY Gross Margin was slightly below 25%!

And margins are relevant to this issue because they reliably indicate whether a venture has a chance of being profitable.

The strong likelihood is that overall both Backers and Layers lose on Betfair after commission.

If so then the ATO discriminatory targetting of Layers would not have a legal leg to stand on.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-May-14, 01:40 PM
jfc,

There is a reason I was carefull to include references to both arbitrage and betting like a bookmaker rather than 'just laying'.

Fours
ps the govt will never allow the masses to claim their losses - even if specific legislation is required to do so if the courts surprise them.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-14, 01:58 PM
jfc,

There is a reason I was carefull to include references to both arbitrage and betting like a bookmaker rather than 'just laying'.

Fours
ps the govt will never allow the masses to claim their losses - even if specific legislation is required to do so if the courts surprise them.

fours,

Looking back on your initial post, there is ambiguity.

You now seem to be coupling "laying and arbitrage".

Whereas I interpreted that on the basis of your presumed alter-ego who had a emphatic set against just Laying.

As to arbitrage, I still am unclear as to what that means.

For example I earlier noted that United where a true $10 chance for the premiership.

Yet I was able to Lay them for heaps at ~$7 - even.

Trouble was that I could not "arb" back on Betfair or elsewhere, and was  therefore left with a very ugly exposure position.

Thankfully I was asleep throughout the drama, as I could have done myself tremendous damage wealth and health-wise.










Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-May-14, 02:08 PM
jfc,

I have yet to lay a horse on Betfair it is true.

However such is the case to ensure a 100% certainty that the ATO wont touch me should I happen to snare 100% of a few 40g first fours or quaddies down the road rather than a trifling % for now. Those who 'lay' simply put wont have that 100% certainty. The more their activities tend toards bookmaker or 'trader' the less certain they can be.

However on this thread I have been discussing the likely ATO's approach to Z rather than punters in general. they will make a complete case and as such much of the argument simply wont apply to the masses or for that matter 'just layers'.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-14, 02:26 PM
jfc,

I have yet to lay a horse on Betfair it is true.

However such is the case to ensure a 100% certainty that the ATO wont touch me should I happen to snare 100% of a few 40g first fours or quaddies down the road rather than a trifling % for now. Those who 'lay' simply put wont have that 100% certainty. The more their activities tend toards bookmaker or 'trader' the less certain they can be.

However on this thread I have been discussing the likely ATO's approach to Z rather than punters in general. they will make a complete case and as such much of the argument simply wont apply to the masses or for that matter 'just layers'.

Fours

In Zeljko's case we can now be confident that he enjoys double-digit kickbacks in 2 of our TABs and nearly that in NSW.

That alone regularly knocks a consolidated Quinella market in to below 100%.

Anyone doubting me, a simple calculation on just NSW and Supertab approximates should placate you.

As that clearly gives Zeljko potential immunity from the ATO's "intrusion of chance", then the tax implications seem clear.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: henry12 on 2012-May-15, 09:49 PM
Whilst this discussion is focusing on the taxation implications for this guy , i think its fundamentally wrong . why dont we all get kick backs from the tab
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: philby42 on 2012-May-15, 09:51 PM
have you considered joining the number one club?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: whispering on 2012-May-16, 02:36 AM
I would probably dedicate my life to punting if I got any kind of rebate. I know the smaller poker sites that I play on offer "rakeback" which is in essence rebates for playing there.


Unfortunately the biggest often dont need to give out these kinds of incentives (Pokerstars, TABs) to John Everypunter, but the ones who run the show get the best deals.

The rich get rich and the poor will eventually walk away.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-May-19, 09:24 AM
http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/sas-billion-dollar-punters-revealed/story-e6frea6u-1226360662136

How many genii does Zeljko need to change a lightbulb!

Anyway this is hardly news to followers of this thread.


......

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/ipad/step-inside-worlds-most-secretive-gambling-club/story-fn6bqpju-1226360636229

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jun-07, 01:21 PM
http://www.smh.com.au/national/triads-drugs-and-highrise-death-a-jail-tale-from-champagne-jimmy-20090801-e53v.html

http://www.smh.com.au/national/party-boy-lived-fast-lost-30m-died-young-20090801-e53w.html

I've mentioned Michael Bastian before, in his connection with the VITAB fraud where Zeljko Ranogajec and David Walsh were principal beneficiaries.

However I've only recently noticed these pertinent articles.

Here, I don't know whom to believe.

But am comforted by not living in a high rise, when noting the ironical demise of that high flier.
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jun-09, 04:57 AM
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/superracing/worlds-biggest-punter-moves-overseas/story-fn67tz2v-1226389508768

"Tasmanian-born Zeljko Ranogajec has moved overseas and ceased betting $1 billion a year through the Australian TAB system."

What a load of unmitigated cloaca issue!

Has either Tatts Group or Tabcorp released any ASX announcements about this alleged loss of turnover?

Why do his staff betting into NSW still front up each day to their top-secret Tabcorp-provided top floor somewhere in Randwick - known only to Scott Woodward but not difficult to guess, considering much of the joint has been demolished?

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Jun-09, 08:42 AM


Why do his staff betting into NSW still front up each day to their top-secret Tabcorp-provided top floor somewhere in Randwick - known only to Scott Woodward but not difficult to guess, considering much of the joint has been demolished?



This secret location funded by the TAB is an urban myth. He has his own offices that are no where near a racecourse and not in a Tab building.

I have told you before, Scott Woodward has a very shaky grip on reality and listening to him about anything will send you up the wrong path.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jun-09, 10:01 AM
This secret location funded by the TAB is an urban myth. He has his own offices that are no where near a racecourse and not in a Tab building.

I have told you before, Scott Woodward has a very shaky grip on reality and listening to him about anything will send you up the wrong path.

Recently I challenged readers to find the mistakes in Woodward's Betfair calculations, and I suspected I earlier made it clear that I am perfectly capable of discerning when he happens to get something right.


'Because of his sheer turnover Zeljko commands the red carpet
treatment from every Tote in the world, and he gets it. If he asks for
the top floor in the High Performance room at Randwick race course
for some of his staff to crunch numbers, the answer is “no problem sir,
anything else, what would you like for lunch?” '

That mangled statement was substantially correct at the time of writing, and is still current.

What Scott neglected to mention was that whichever employee sourced him that information faces instant dismissal.


http://www.championprofits.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Living-Learning-with-the-Worlds-Biggest-Punters.pdf

Perhaps Runway could post a snap of the facility when he's there on Monday?

Those with the most tenuous grip on reality are the jaundiced media feeding us the "Zeljko has left the building" cobblers.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-04, 03:50 PM
http://afr.com/p/national/ato_targets_punters_club_p2kW1NQlZaaKJmkW0XK8MK

The $2.5 Billion Punters' Club.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-07, 06:59 AM
http://www.news.com.au/national/secret-club-wealthy-gamblers-is-going-to-war/story-fndo4bst-1226419498897

Finally!

Names named.

Zeljko's true address revealed. He's Kylie Minogue's neighbour!

And their impressive POT of 2.5%.

Adjusting for double-digit kickbacks suggests a LOT of ~7%.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-07, 10:14 AM
They are pretty lucky the ATO has only gone back to 2004, I recall the syndicate members betting 'on course' in the early 1990's, although they did not get rebates  until they got the idea to buy a pub and later go offshore to Vanuatu to run their own TAB.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-07, 10:24 AM
jfc wrote.....

"And their impressive POT of 2.5%.

Adjusting for double-digit kickbacks suggests a LOT of ~7%."


So when I read in the press that these blokes are gambling wizards, geni etc it is all b******t, they are no better than 95% of all punters, without rebates they would be losers, unless, of course, their stated profit of 2.5% of turnover is understated for reasons best known to them  :what: :what:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: value on 2012-Jul-08, 02:38 AM
No. Basic mug punters psychology.

If you invest in many of the less favoured in the market (which ups your investment for rebate purposes) and have them shorter early in the market than they should be, where does the mug money go? Particularly for exotics?


Tasmanian racing funding and how much less is being invested since Tatts rejected rebates when they tookover from the Tote.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-07-06/racing-funds/4115786
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-08, 12:05 PM
The hard-copy Tele actually names the full list of 19.

Would be handy for all to see, if anyone has it.

Anyway, one of the missing names is Peter Bowen.

He used to write features in the Sportsman about 2YO Barrier Trials.

He was in the news more recently, but I'm surprised it didn't get much coverage in Australia.

http://www.watoday.com.au/world/woman-charged-over-death-of-aussie-poker-king-20090710-dfnn.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-08, 01:18 PM
Extra names are something like:


Peter Bowen

Lisa Aitken

Tim Filby

Steve Atkinson

Alex Moore

John Reynolds

Rod Hyland

Zoe Davis

Martin Burns

Ron Firman
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-08, 03:37 PM
Zoe Davis was the syndicate's "on course runner" in Victoria in the early 1990's.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-09, 01:58 PM
http://www.afr.com/p/national/no_humbling_great_gambler_1RahGi92iAkDFfUmE87CeO

And here's a cute insight into:

The King of Keno Kickbacks
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-18, 01:34 PM
Allegedly tonight at 1830 Channel 7 will run something about our kontroversial Ksar of Kickbacks.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-18, 06:42 PM
Allegedly tonight at 1830 Channel 7 will run something about our kontroversial Ksar of Kickbacks.



You moron Wilkie!

Moron, Moron, Moron!

Where do you draw the line?

300 employees should do the trick.

Or double-digit kickbacks.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Rodent on 2012-Jul-18, 06:52 PM
That story was a joke.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-18, 07:38 PM
I missed the program, where can I get a link to it ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2012-Jul-18, 08:28 PM
Bubba

http://au.news.yahoo.com/today-tonight/latest/article/-/14265510/secret-gambling-society/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2012-Jul-18, 08:52 PM
Yes, any doubts that Wilkie is a dill are totally removed.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Entropy on 2012-Jul-18, 09:29 PM
Rod Hyland, "the punting jeweler"  from Bathurst St to Hadley's from Hadley's to the Waggon my that little man travels.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: muttonbird on 2012-Jul-18, 10:27 PM
If anything it highlights the difference in personalities of Walsh & Zed. Walsh sticks his head out, wants to make a name for himself. Zed sticks to Loch Ness.

In their line of business it pays to keep a low profile. Now the ATO is sniffing around.

I wonder if they are still mates? Love to be a fly on the wall.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 05:22 AM
http://afr.com/p/national/documents_stolen_in_punters_club_POofsHL7Tn6rZY0k6sChQI

Not exactly sure what the handing over of allegedly stolen documents achieves, if the ATO has had them since 2005.


Not the first time stealing has been alleged in connection with the group.

-----

For some reason this reminded of a perplexing incident where the then wife of aforementioned syndicate member Peter Bowen went public on TV offering a $20,000 reward for a stolen laptop.

I've heard speculation that there were more than just family snaps recorded there.


http://www.theage.com.au/news/technology/20000-reward-for-stolen-memories/2007/08/30/1188067241318.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2012-Jul-19, 09:41 AM
Bubba

http://au.news.yahoo.com/today-tonight/latest/article/-/14265510/secret-gambling-society/

Their success was phenomenal - being students they played with small amounts, picking winning combinations at Keno.....

  :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 12:01 PM
The google and AFR inconsistency is a real drag.

I would have been prepared to buy the AFR, had I known about this intriguing article.

Trouble is google only discovers it months later.


http://afr.com/p/national/winners_aren_always_grinners_XrKryxeYKyqWx7rINQulsO
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2012-Jul-19, 12:04 PM
Their success was phenomenal - being students they played with small amounts, picking winning combinations at Keno.....

   :lol:  

Yes, and the card counting, too.   :nowink:

We all know the theory, but to suggest it can be profitable on a table with multiple decks, is nonsense.   Of course the casinos like to perpetuate the myth, because it gives the gullible some hope.  In reality, it's about 0.5% to the house, played perfectly.  Good game, regardless.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 12:35 PM
Yes, and the card counting, too.   :nowink:

We all know the theory, but to suggest it can be profitable on a table with multiple decks, is nonsense.   Of course the casinos like to perpetuate the myth, because it gives the gullible some hope.  In reality, it's about 0.5% to the house, played perfectly.  Good game, regardless.


Just goes to show how lame that program was.

The only skill in Keno is determining underbacked combinations, to limit the chances of collision with a mug play. That is a historical exercise that is far removed from the program suggested concept of Zeljko doing an in the run form analysis on the merits of undisclosed random numbers running hot.

Onto blackjack.

Multiple decks per se don't inconvenience Zeljko, as he would be into shuffle tracking, as described in the film 21 (which I haven't caught).

It was automatic shuffling machines that killed him.

Fortunately he has an endless supply of graft embracing government agencies' officials that allow him kickbacks so obscene that they wipe out all competitors.

By the way, that should wipe out the industry in question, once the deals get adequately publicised.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2012-Jul-19, 01:37 PM

The only skill in Keno is determining underbacked combinations, to limit the chances of collision with a mug play. That is a historical exercise that is far removed from the program suggested concept of Zeljko doing an in the run form analysis on the merits of undisclosed random numbers running hot.


That's only applicable on jackpot pools. And because successive Keno draws are statistically independent events, I would argue that determining the "underbacked" combinations is a strategy fraught with danger.

There was the famous "adventure" back in 1994:

From wikipaedia:

In 1994, Ranogajec reportedly won a $7.5 million Keno jackpot at the leisure and entertainment complex North Ryde RSL Club, of New South Wales, after reportedly betting "significantly more than $7.5 million" to win it but coming out ahead on account of the additional, smaller prizes awarded along the way to the jackpot.

I remember this one. The keno jackpot grew naturally to about $3 million (from memory). At this point they started using system cards to cover multiple combinations, and the jackpot raced away over the next day or so.

What happened in the background was this got a bit of publicity and every desperate and his dog (including me) started spending more on the 10 number jackpot.

They got it eventually, but if someone had happened to jag it before they did, would have resulted in one of the largest gambling losses in Australia's history - if not the largest.

I notice they haven't been back for seconds  :)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: specialweek on 2012-Jul-19, 01:43 PM
The reporter must have very little knowledge of gambling and probability.
"As they were students they were betting on Keno in small amounts but still making money".
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 02:41 PM
That's only applicable on jackpot pools. And because successive Keno draws are statistically independent events, I would argue that determining the "underbacked" combinations is a strategy fraught with danger.


Zeljko (and co) play only Jackpot pools. Above a certain predetermined level.

An underbacked combo is just as likely as a popular one. But avoiding the former improves your chance of not sharing the windfall.

Furthemore as that recent AFR article shows Zeljko has been thriving on many kickback-enhanced Keno 7 spot pools since the 1994 incident.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2012-Jul-19, 05:37 PM
Ok, What is an underbacked combo and where do you get this info ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 05:52 PM
Ok, What is an underbacked combo and where do you get this info ?
Sounds like you've never patronised a dog track and looked at the 1-8 Quinella approximates.

Many underbacked combos are those not overbacked.

Trawl through Keno outlets for losing tickets, then run a statistical analysis on
- numbers backed more than average
- relative frequency of adjacent numbers.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Jul-19, 06:10 PM
The underbet numbers in Lotto are those over 30 because of all the muppetts taking their families birthdays, Keno would be similar
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-19, 07:17 PM
All the higher numbers in Lotto are underbet because..

A.Birth dates in a month, no person has a birth date over 31
B. Home street numbers...less homes have higher numbers..there is a number 1 or 2 or 3 etc in every street but not necessarily a number 31 or 32 etc

Some years ago the Lotto jackpot was shared by an abnormal number of winners yet the numbers made no sense until one looked at the way they were set out on the entry coupon..they forrned a perfect pattern.
 
Even if one avoids the low numbers and does not fill out numbers in a pattern, the chances of winning , however remote, are no different from the muppets, only that you have a better chance of not sharing with the muppets if you stick to the high numbers, then again, I do not fancy the odds and the huge takeout rate.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-19, 07:30 PM
The reporter must have very little knowledge of gambling and probability.
"As they were students they were betting on Keno in small amounts but still making money".


I guess " small amounts" of money are relative. To the muppets that might mean Z was only betting $5.00 a game, whereas Z might have considered $10,000.00 small change, beer money, or something for the sideboard, like the late, "Melbourne" Mick Bartley, referred to a  $10,000.00 bet when questioned by stewards all those years ago   :biggrin:     :biggrin:  

In 1994 Z was around 30 years, of age and by that time he and his partners were betting full time on mainland Australia, so where that reporter got the idea he was a student and betting small amounts on Keino leaves one to think who feed him that line. :what: :what:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 07:43 PM
I guess " small amounts" of money are relative. To the muppets that might mean Z was only betting $5.00 a game, whereas Z might have considered $10,000.00 small change, beer money, or something for the sideboard, like the late, "Melbourne" Mick Bartley, referred to a  $10,000.00 bet when questioned by stewards all those years ago   :biggrin:     :biggrin:  

Zeljko was almost certainly not playing Keno then. It would have required a bank of several 100 thousand.

And I wonder whether Keno was around in 1979.

In Melbourne Mick's testimony to some regulator about that sum, he dismissed it as toilet paper.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2012-Jul-19, 07:52 PM
Who are the Muppets you guys are talking about ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-19, 07:55 PM
Keno introduced In Australia


NSW/SA 1991/92
VIC 1993/94
TAS 1996/97
QLD 1997/98

I doubt Z was a student back when Keno was introduced in 1991/92, and was betting in "small amounts" as some one has told the naive reporter on C7.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-19, 07:55 PM
Who are the Muppets you guys are talking about ?

Are you for real ? The viewers who watch any of those 6.30 night programs on C7 & C9, would have no idea what was a "small amount" to Z. The other Muppets can be seen any day in any TAB.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Jul-19, 08:30 PM
Assuming Z is around 50 years of age he was born around 1962. The first casino in Australia was in Tasmania in 1972 therefore he probably was a student when he took up counting cards at that casino in 1982 (circa ), however when he " took on" the Keino jackpot in 1994 he was well past his "student days' and the naive reporter on C7 may have been confused about Z betting small amounts at the casino back in 1982 compared to his betting chasing the Keino jackpot 12 years later.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-19, 08:45 PM
Assuming Z is around 50 years of age he was born around 1962. The first casino in Australia was in Tasmania in 1972 therefore he probably was a student when he took up counting cards at that casino in 1982 (circa ), however when he " took on" the Keino jackpot in 1994 he was well past his "student days' and the naive reporter on C7 may have been confused about Z betting small amounts at the casino back in 1982 compared to his betting chasing the Keino jackpot 12 years later.

I did actually allude to 1979 earlier.

Zeljko was born in 1961, hence started playing (legally) in 1979. And soon ran into Alan Woods.

That 7 reporter clearly proved himself a cloaca on so many occasions in that report. He provided enough material for hours of Media Watch.

The Keno claim was plain wrong.

And I cannot believe his illiterate assassination of the pronunciation of "Ranogajec".

Why didn't he ask Stefanovic, Kekovic or Kalac or some other compatriot for help?

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Carbine1890 on 2012-Jul-24, 02:06 PM
Zeljko and his syndicate confederates also owned and operated a "Casino" in Sydney (pre Starcity) during the late mid to late 80s
an ex girlfriend of mine worked there along with Shelley his partner dealing blackjack, it was a very nicely done out place, if i remember
rightly it was called the Acorn or something similar.
I didn't realize nor ever thought they'd become so big in horse racing.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Jul-24, 02:23 PM
Zeljko and his syndicate confederates also owned and operated a "Casino" in Sydney (pre Starcity) during the late mid to late 80s
an ex girlfriend of mine worked there along with Shelley his partner dealing blackjack, it was a very nicely done out place, if i remember
rightly it was called the Acorn or something similar.
I didn't realize nor ever thought they'd become so big in horse racing.


I understand that then NSW Premier Neville Wran effectively legalised Blackjack Parlours for a while.

But that did not last long.

Obviously there would have been many patrons at that establishment, so  it's interesting why that aspect of their career has remained unpublicised.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Aug-02, 02:33 PM
http://www.smh.com.au/national/36m-in-profits-gambling-business-just-a-hobby-ato-told-20120802-23gpf.html

Not sure what's new here.

But at least the ATO is pressing on, evidently not smitten by Zeljko's public charm offensive.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: dubbledee on 2012-Aug-09, 07:26 PM
Not everyone knows how to count cards at Blackjack and play systems at Roulette.

From smh.com.au

TEN high rollers whose cheques bounced when the Star casino presented them for payment have been ordered to pay $8.85 million, although there are doubts the casino will be able to recoup its losses from the overseas gamblers.

The biggest bounced cheque was $4.98 million drawn on a Hong Kong account of Thai businessman Nattachai Srirungsukpinij. He has been ordered by the NSW Supreme Court to pay $5.33 million, with interest accruing at $1126 a day.

The Star sued the 10 individuals in February this year, but it was only in late May that it revealed it would write off $22.9 million in bad debts incurred by international VIP customers introduced to it by SilkStar, a gambling junket operator. SilkStar went into liquidation in March, owing the Star $7 million.

The court record shows the casino extended cheque cashing facilities to the high rollers, who were mainly from Thailand, Singapore and Malaysia, early last year. The cheques started to bounce in April, and on one day - June 28 - two cheques, totalling $896,000, presented by the casino were rejected.

Advertisement With none of the gamblers contesting claims against them, judgments totalling $8.85 million have been made by the court.

Three of the judgments were for amounts below $100,000. Four more of the bounced cheques involved more than half a million dollars. With interest, Thai businesswoman Pimchaya Wattanakulyothin has been ordered to pay $799,484, Somboon Srisombattanakit $541,980, Krairurg Kodcha $522,397 and Vissanu Wiangnak $674,000.

News of the VIP gamblers' bad debts gave ammunition to the Crown chairman, James Packer, in his recent bid for Crown to get a seat on the board of the Star's owner, Echo Entertainment.

A spokesman for the Star yesterday refused to answer whether it had revised its policy of providing cash chequing facilities to high rollers or on its chances of recouping the debts.

Given the value casino operators put on ensuring the privacy of their high-rollers, the public court action is a high-profile foray into debt collection.

Read mo http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/court-orders-stars-high-rollers-to-pay-885m-after-cheques-bounce-20120808-23un0.html#ixzz232VeD8RR
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Aug-09, 08:01 PM
DD

Big difference their rebates would not have exceeded his losses, and they were probably mugs with plenty of money, whereas no one would consider Z a "mug"whose rebate was more than his losses.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2012-Aug-09, 09:10 PM
they were probably mugs with plenty of money

But not in the accounts on which the cheques were drawn.

BTW

Who would have those amounts in a cheque account?

Seems to me the some process re-assessement is required.  :chin:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Aug-09, 09:32 PM



Three of the judgments were for amounts below $100,000. Four more of the bounced cheques involved more than half a million dollars. With interest, Thai businesswoman Pimchaya Wattanakulyothin   has been ordered to pay $799,484, Somboon Srisombattanakit  $541,980, Krairurg Kodcha $522,397 and Vissanu Wiangnak $674,000.


I presume they will track down those first two named down through a Bangkok Telephone Directory, otherwise they might lose them along the way. ;)

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Aug-10, 05:01 AM
http://m.smh.com.au/national/background-of-punters-club-boss-revealed-20120809-23x6u.html

http://www.afr.com/p/national/gambling_genius_began_betting_at_bEQAKrqgA0G4hpcxb6pjMO

''[Mr Ranogajec's] first encounter with gambling was at around the age of 12,'' says his appeal statement, lodged with the court this week.

''His father was a regular visitor to Wrest Point Casino and at home the applicant would experiment with systems using a toy roulette wheel.''

----

Wow!

What a revealing background!

Everything you ever wanted to know about Zeljko!

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Aug-10, 08:41 AM
Z is certainly no mug, but he is not a "genius" ( AFR ). He is certainly innovative ( buying a hotel to get a small rebate as owner of TAB outlet), clever ( moving off shore to Vanuatu to get  bigger rebates, then moving operation back to Tassie to get an even bigger rebates), but from all accounts, excepting last F/Y in Tassie when settlements given back from Tabcorp amounted  to around $69 million that year, indicated he may have won, but without rebates he may actually lose on his punting. Betting to break even is not beyond many punters but they are not considered geniuses.  
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Aug-10, 01:24 PM
. Betting to break even is not beyond many punters but they are not considered geniuses.  


Breaking even isnt difficult.

Breaking even when you account for 8-10% of the pool is considerabley more difficult.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Aug-10, 03:08 PM
Antitab
That is a valid point, but if a loss can be kept to under 2 % the rebates will take care of that loss.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Aug-13, 05:21 AM
http://www.news.com.au/sport/superracing/jockey-glyn-schofield-produced-a-first-with-his-honest-assessment-of-his-ride-at-warwick-farm/story-fndpqu3p-1226448725546

"ONE of my most accurate legmen tells me mammoth punter Zeljko Ranogajec has had the money in his TAB and Betfair accounts frozen as he fights the tax office over a claim for 900 odd million bucks. Racing authorities must be dismayed by the freeze as every time Zeljko has a bet, and he has plenty, racing gets a fortune out of the deductions.

TALKING about deductions, Ray Murrihy, just back from a stewards conference in Istanbul, reports the deductions taken out of the tote pool in Turkey are 30c for the win pool and 50c the place. Racing in Turkey, which caters for other breeds as well as thoroughbreds, is on the up and two new tracks are being built to take the total to seven and incredibly the tote turnover is rising."

Pull the other one!

In both cases, Zeljko's turnover and kickbacks are alive and well and living in places outside the jurisdiction or cognition of the ATO!

With malicious drivel like this Ken seems to be gunning after Max's senility crown!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Aug-13, 09:11 AM


TALKING about deductions, Ray Murrihy, just back from a stewards conference in Istanbul, reports the deductions taken out of the tote pool in Turkey are 30c for the win pool and 50c the place. Racing in Turkey, which caters for other breeds as well as thoroughbreds, is on the up and two new tracks are being built to take the total to seven and incredibly the tote turnover is rising."


As I am no longer going to bet into Supertab pools, does anyone know whether there are any jobs going inTurkey for racing administrators or any totalisator directorships as with those takeout rates there must be some spillage over to those type of jobs ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arthur on 2012-Aug-13, 12:06 PM
If those figures are fair dinkum . . .

They would need plenty of people who can handle wheelbarrows  :blush:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Sep-01, 06:06 AM
http://www.afr.com/p/national/money_magic_makes_billions_disappear_oHyu9FiLwUcuPzefN3zg7O

Hard Hearted Hannah Low doesn't seem to be buying the hobby angle!

Surely Xenophon will be rushing in to rescue any moment now.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Sep-01, 06:47 PM
Once bitten, twice shy, Xenophon might be a bit wary of going into bat for punters, in view of his support of that punter taking on Bet 365 over his 'lucky win' on that Ipswich dog race.I will not even mention his support for Walsh, or was it Bobby Brown and Andy Wilkie , both of whom supported  the hobby angle ?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Sep-02, 10:31 AM
This deserves closer look.


"Creative lawyers and secret offshore bank accounts were not the only way Steicke, whose internet profile identifies him as a futures trader, made the money disappear. He would set up loss-making futures and options trades.

The key was to have transactions with related parties – the corresponding company was an offshore entity, with the beneficial owners being the Punters Club. This enabled the money to be moved from Steicke’s base in Hong Kong – where he did most of his betting – to a company owned by the club.

Steicke, on behalf of the club, then registered a loss in Hong Kong. From the outside it seemed the money had vanished.

This enabled the money to move to the more favourable jurisdictions of Switzerland and Liechtenstein, where the funds’ ownership was protected by privacy laws.

The Financial Review is not suggesting that any illegal trading was taking place.

Even after the couple moved back to Adelaide, Steicke visited Switzerland regularly. Some of the accounts were even thought to be in his wife’s name, and he often had his name on documents which served as a blind trust for the rest of the club.

His Swiss bank deposits are thought to have risen to staggering amounts – but that didn’t help Elisabeth after her marriage broke down. She worried she saw only what her ex wanted her to see."


Interesting that the AFR is not suggesting this is illegal.

If it is legal I wonder how many others are trying similar stunts?



Pity Betfair is illegal in HK as the Betfair route might have worked even better.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Sep-02, 05:32 PM
Apropos my Hard Hearted Hannah Low allusion:

First time I was stunned by it was by Peggy Lee. Ella makes a great fist of it as does Ray Charles, and most others.

Composed nearly 100 years ago it has a timeless quality.

The mind boggles at what incident could have provoked Milton Ager, Charles Bates, Robert Bigelow & Jack Yellon in 1924 to unburden themselves this way.

http://www.metrolyrics.com/hard-hearted-hannah-lyrics-ella-fitzgerald.html

As in the introduction for the winner of my pick for the best version available:

They don't write songs like this anymore.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Sep-15, 06:30 AM
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/adelaide-mum-elisabeth-steicke-takes-on-billion-dollar-international-betting-syndicate-punters-club/story-fndo471r-1226474488250

"Their autistic son, now a teenager, attends a top private school and has paid carers to look after him. Ms Steicke's annual living costs, including caring for her son, amount to $5 million, according to documents."

If David Steicke has been kicked out of the Club, then where is he finding a spare $5 million to fund Elizabeth's living costs?

He now has a new family.

Must be lucky to have found a new wife that doesn't mind him paying out that, as well as perpetually hanging out in Poker dens.

--------

Cute example of journalistic precision retained by google:

"When Elizabeth Steicke's 10-year marriage to Walsh ended, she went to the Australian Federal Police and spilled his secrets. Now the founder ..."

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/relationships/dumped-first-wives-take-their-revenge-in-drawn-out-marital-asset-battles/story-fnet09y4-1226463086837

---------

(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRNIhjbmnW3o4nNtczL9kPwZcg6lJGCcmAnfD2E81HGe1MMVCpu)

From his apparel it looks like he might be earning a bit from sponsoring a female orgasm enhancer.

http://osquared.com/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2012-Sep-15, 07:33 AM
jfc,

Do you think a big player, like Z, is behind Tom Waterhouse?

I have a suspicion he is merely the marketing tool front man of a big player that is merely chasing rebates....

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2012-Sep-15, 08:11 AM
Tom is the front man for his father.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: usernametaken on 2012-Sep-15, 09:44 AM
I thought it was his Grandfather originally.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2012-Sep-15, 01:53 PM
I thought it's D Nikolic.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-20, 04:53 AM
http://afr.com/p/national/punters_club_cuts_deal_with_ato_Lpn9VjiEbzGQbz50DeVPbN

Professional gambler and art collector David Walsh and friends in a multibillion-dollar punters club have done a secret deal with the Australian Taxation Office to settle a case relating to hundreds of millions in unpaid tax.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jimbler on 2012-Oct-20, 07:03 AM
Quote
It is thought the ATO was chasing about $600 million in unpaid tax dating back to 2004.

Is that all
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-Oct-20, 07:11 PM
http://afr.com/p/national/punters_club_cuts_deal_with_ato_Lpn9VjiEbzGQbz50DeVPbN

Professional gambler and art collector David Walsh and friends in a multibillion-dollar punters club have done a secret deal with the Australian Taxation Office to settle a case relating to hundreds of millions in unpaid tax.


I sense the relief in your post.

Finally your battle is over
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-22, 07:06 AM
http://afr.com/p/national/punters_club_cuts_deal_with_ato_Lpn9VjiEbzGQbz50DeVPbN

https://ja.twitter.com/HannahLow3

http://www.tabcorp.com.au/resources.ashx/mediareleases/692/downloadableVersion/B93F7884F071A5E9218BEFDBA6AF71FF/18_October_-_Investor_Day.pdf

---------

Hannah Low has expanded on my earlier link. She is also a rare twitterer.

And look at Philby's TAB link to see how much misinformation the media has peddled about Zeljko's Australian activities.

Tabcorp's Isle of Man stunt seems to have one solitary purpose. To keep the Z Team's income away from the clutches of the ATO.

Even though majority of the members still reside in Australia!

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-24, 11:31 AM
http://www.australianracinggreyhound.com/australian-greyhound-racing/greyhound-betting-australian-greyhound-racing/tax-office-does-deals/37543

"Of course, whether Walsh & Co benefitted Greyhound Racing, or racing in general, is a moot point. Their modus operandi is based on screwing down TAB deductions to negligible, or even negative, levels so they often made money even when their selections failed. The old government-owned Tastote itself was unable to make decent profits due to the weight of the Punters Club money. To some degree, everyday punters were paying for the Walsh discounts."

Cute word "moot".

Not only does it mean "not worth debating" but also the opposite.

The degree everyday punters were subsiding these vanquishers of the ATO was 100%.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Baker on 2012-Oct-24, 03:04 PM
jfc

You are 100% correct, with what has been going on with the Punters Club. The poor little punters have been put through the "Spin Cycle" until there is nothing left and the Punters Club have extracted all the profits from them. What these TAB's have done to accommodate the Punters Club is absolutely criminal and should never have been allowed to happen. Publicans for example, that pay exorbitant fees to show races in their establishments and do all the work collecting money for the TAB's get something like 2% commission from the TAB's (here in Qld anyway). Also the bigger their turnover, the less commission they get paid. What a joke.

I am also fairly sure that the TAB's biggest enemies, the Corporates have accounts with them and are also getting huge commissions when they lay off.

How long is it going to be before the Government and the TAB's wake up and combine their totes to one pool and take away half the Corporates business overnight and stop paying these exorbitant commissions and start giving the profits back to Joe Public.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: carey on 2012-Oct-24, 03:46 PM
jfc

You are 100% correct, with what has been going on with the Punters Club. The poor little punters have been put through the "Spin Cycle" until there is nothing left and the Punters Club have extracted all the profits from them. What these TAB's have done to accommodate the Punters Club is absolutely criminal and should never have been allowed to happen. Publicans for example, that pay exorbitant fees to show races in their establishments and do all the work collecting money for the TAB's get something like 2% commission from the TAB's (here in Qld anyway). Also the bigger their turnover, the less commission they get paid. What a joke.

I am also fairly sure that the TAB's biggest enemies, the Corporates have accounts with them and are also getting huge commissions when they lay off.

How long is it going to be before the Government and the TAB's wake up and combine their totes to one pool and take away half the Corporates business overnight and stop paying these exorbitant commissions and start giving the profits back to Joe Public.

i have a file detailing the rebate level of one of the corporates.
so i guess they are all in receipt of rebates.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: VoRogue on 2012-Oct-24, 03:47 PM
The corporates are basically pimps, copping as much as 5% for laying off punters bets back to the TAB, i thought the object of a punters exercise in having a decent sized bet with a corporate was to not reduce the dividend, unfortunately the reality is quite the opposite, the pimps put the money straight into the TAB pool. And what's more, they make large punters sign agreements to turn over a certain amount of money per year (in the multiple millions of course), the larger the amount the bigger the kickback. And they have the HIDE to say they advocate RESPONSIBLE GAMBLING ! Who was that black wrestler in the 80's, i think is was Sweet Daddy Brown, drooping in gold jewellry and a glamour on each arm going to ringside, with his famous catchcry "PIMPIN' AINT EASY" And if race fixing is happening, and i'd say that's a CERTAINTY, the TAB are playing their part offering inducements to bet bigger, there's plenty of incentive for a jockey to ride badly in a lowly country maiden where his riding fee might be lucky to be $400 IF HE WINS, what's it worth to a race fixer to have a fav or 2nd fav out of the money ? I'm seeing a lot of fancied horses missing the start badly of late over sprints, that's a good way to get one beat  >:(  i absolutely CRINGE every time i see that Matthew Newton lookalike in the TAb commercials holding up his winning ticket and locking his lips around another GUY  :o In the real world he'd be charged with sexual assault for that (unless the recipient was gay then he might actually enjoy it) Just stick to baby doll Jaimee Rogers doing the TAB ads at least she's watchable, keep the bad dancers and the young urban professionals off the TV screens  emthdown
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-27, 03:33 AM
http://www.afr.com/p/national/on_punters_club_tax_office_backs_tOeA0xvd0bf8TsyE2OYjKK

http://www.afr.com/p/national/the_tax_office_punt_that_flopped_v1nv8Q4drokQ0dif4l9hEN

$400 million gift.

Not to mention the continuing millions in Kickbacks.

Leona Helmsley hit the nail right on the head.

Just like Peter V'Landys.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Oct-27, 01:53 PM
According to the AFR  the settlement between Jeljko, Walsh and the ATO only related to betting profits in Tasmania & South Australia between 2004-11  and does not include other Australian jurisdictions or the vast betting that takes place overseas. The Punters Club , of which Jeljko & Walsh have been members has been betting as a group sincw 1991..  :shy: :shy:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-29, 10:26 AM

By my estimation:

1985 Zeljko and Walsh start betting Sydney
1992 Leaves track course for Kickbacks via PubTABs
1994 King of Keno Kickbacks
1997 VITAB Fraud

So Hobby Model seems to have been the same for the last 20 years.

----

Meanwhile the full story is now available.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/the_tax_office_punt_that_flopped_v1nv8Q4drokQ0dif4l9hEN

Wonder if the ATO had any surveillance at Steicke's party, in case some ecstatic "in vino veritas" loosened lips?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Steve M on 2012-Oct-29, 11:25 AM
Can't read it's login site.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Oct-29, 06:16 PM
By my estimation:

1985 Zeljko and Walsh start betting Sydney
1992 Leaves track course for Kickbacks via PubTABs
1994 King of Keno Kickbacks
1997 VITAB Fraud




1985 Zeljko and Walsh start betting in Melbourne  with "A team"
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-Oct-29, 06:50 PM
Following an exhaustive and expensive audit covering many years, the matter has been resolved.

The ATO is happy, but jfc, the google king/queen, is not?  :whistle:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2012-Oct-29, 06:55 PM
Following an exhaustive and expensive audit covering many years, the matter has been resolved.

The ATO is happy, but jfc, the google king/queen, is not?  :whistle:

According to that AFR article the ATO only extracted tax for the years 2004>2011, whatever happened for the years back to 1985 would make interesting reading.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: D-G on 2012-Oct-29, 07:04 PM
According to that AFR article the ATO only extracted tax for the years 2004>2011, whatever happened for the years back to 1985 would make interesting reading.
Lets start by saying the AFR have disgraced themselves with their highly innacurate reporting of this story all along  :yes:
They have contradicted themselves countless times and basically mad up stories to sell their floundering paper

As for pre 2004, well, isn't there a time frame on financial records?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Oct-30, 07:17 AM
Note that the ATO has not yet finished with David Steicke and this offers a glimmer of hope that Australian taxpayers might actually salvage something from this fiasco.

Surely Elisabeth Steicke is entitled to at least 50% of David's assets during the period they were married?

And David is legally obliged to disclose all his assets for that time.

And this bombshell is quite helpful:

"In the late 1990s, the family moved to low-tax Switzerland, where Elisabeth Steicke set up a betting structure for horse racing and sports betting in the US."

Note that if Steicke's assets are uncovered, that could well shed some light on the billion dollar estate of Alan Woods. Still presumably in limbo.

So the ATO should provide whatever assistance it can to Elisabeth to get to the bottom of the assets, in particular, cooperating with HK counterparts.


http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/adelaide-mum-elisabeth-steicke-takes-on-billion-dollar-international-betting-syndicate-punters-club/story-e6frea83-1226474488250
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Dec-01, 06:28 AM
Investigative journalism is in serious decline, but there's some hope with the four below who produced some impressive work on Zeljko, Fetcher & Cunneen, and incessant RVL fiascos.

Kate McClymont
Angus Grigg
Hannah Low
John Silvester

My bet is neither AntiTAB nor Pumper Cassidy were not on the judging panel for Kate's brace of awards!

http://www.smh.com.au/national/double-walkley-honour-for-mcclymont-20121130-2amfk.html

Double Walkley honour for McClymont
Date
December 1, 2012

Brendan Gullifer
 


Acclaimed ... Kate McClymont. Photo: James Alcock
IF JOURNALISM is the first rough draft of history, then the Walkley Awards are its summit, recognising excellence across every facet.

And on Friday night the Herald's veteran reporter Kate McClymont picked up two awards.

The prize for investigative journalism was awarded to her and Linton Besser for their report ''Exposed: Obeids' secret harbour deal''. And McClymont received a Walkley for print news reporting for her story ''Thomson: New credit card claims''.

The Gold Walkley Award was won by Steve Pennells from The West Australian. Earlier in the night he received the Best Scoop of the Year award for his series of stories on the bitter family feud between Gina Rinehart and her estranged children and the Social Equity Journalism Award for "The untold story of the asylum boat tragedy".
The Herald journalists Stuart Washington, Tom Allard and Conrad Walters - working with a team from the University of Technology Sydney - won the Walkley for best digital journalism with their report ''Sky's the limit on political gifts''.

The Age's Nick McKenzie and Richard Baker, who also file for ABC TV's 7.30, won the Walkley for business journalism for their report ''RBA faces questions over bribery connections''.

Jane Cadzow from Good Weekend won the magazine feature writing category for ''The world according to Bryce''. And Fairfax Media's John Silvester, writing for The Age, was the winner in the commentary, analysis, opinion and critique section for his report ''Over coffee, Carl murdered the truth''.

Angus Grigg and Hannah Low, from Fairfax Media's The Australian Financial Review won the award for best newspaper feature writing for ''The Punters' Club - tax, totes and the boys from Tassie''.

 

 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Dec-02, 08:44 AM
For some curious reason this article previously hidden by the AFR has reappeared!

I've preserved most of it here, just in case it once more vanishes like a gambler's lucky streak.


http://afr.com/p/national/the_tax_office_punt_that_flopped_v1nv8Q4drokQ0dif4l9hEN

The Tax Office punt that flopped
PUBLISHED: 27 OCT 2012 00:05:07 | UPDATED: 28 OCT 2012 11:02:40
HANNAH LOW

It’s a party David Steicke has long been waiting for.

The professional punter has spared no extravagance in the planning of his lavish 50th birthday celebration on the shimmering casino strip in exotic Macau this weekend.

The poker player has invited family, friends and fellow punters from all over the world to help him see in his half-century.

But Steicke had something even bigger to toast.

SECRET DEAL WITH ATO
Just over a week earlier his old friends from Tassie, including art collector and philanthropist David Walsh, founder of Tasmania’s Museum of Old and New Art (MONA) and reclusive gambling genius Zeljko Ranogajec, had cut a secret deal with the Australian Taxation Office that has raised the odds Steicke can avoid a long and vicious court battle over his gambling winnings.

Steicke, Walsh and Ranogajec were members of a hand-picked group of high-end gamblers who bet around the world. The ATO had pursued them for billions but just a week ago the case was settled for a lot less.

The hastily-negotiated deal with the group dubbed “the Punters’ Club” raises many questions about how the ATO played what, at least at first glance, looked like a big winning hand.

The memory of its battle against Crocodile Dundee star Paul Hogan must still have been fresh in the minds of senior ATO officials.

ATO LOWERED ITS CLAIM
Once again the ATO had launched a case against a high-profile taxpayer based on insider information about a complicated offshore financial structure. But, confronted with a public outcry, it again struck a deal thought to be well shy of its initial huge claim.

Was the reason that the ATO lowered its claim against the punters due to a lack of evidence or problems with overseas documents?

Or was the hasty settlement a sign that the ATO did not want to become embroiled in years of costly litigation against a group that had very deep pockets?

The 19 members that made up the global gambling syndicate called themselves the “bank-roll” but were later dubbed the Punters’ Club by the Tax Office. They dealt only in cash and by 2005 were turning over at least $2.4 billion a year. They won their billions by using computer programming and algorithms to beat the system.

Hundreds of people were employed by companies that undertook this work. The club even negotiated rebates with TABs around the world that enabled them a certain return on losing bets.

ATO THINKS IT HAS STRUCK GOLD
The syndicate had been in the ATO’s sights for a decade, although its members maintained they had legal and professional advice that they were not liable to pay tax in the same way as non-professional punters.

In 2005, the Tax Office thought it had struck gold because of the fallout when Steicke separated from his wife Elisabeth Capone and moved to Hong Kong.

Steicke was one of the original punters based in Adelaide but he gradually became the man who met accountants, lawyers and other professional advisers, many in Switzerland, determining the best way to structure the club’s operations.

Elisabeth, left in Adelaide and looking after a disabled son, was convinced her ex-husband was hiding assets offshore and contacted both the ATO and the Australian Federal Police within months of her husband leaving her.

Elisabeth wanted revenge and some of the huge assets she believed her husband had built up over his 15 years in the Punters’ Club.

She believed she knew intimate details of the club and its complex operations and was prepared to trade on them. She also had a box of documents her husband left behind and a handful of encrypted discs.

SECRET MEETINGS WITH ATO
So when lawyer Mauro Gagliardi made contact purportedly on behalf of Elisabeth, the ATO seized the opportunity.

The first secret meeting between Gagliardi and ATO officers was arranged at the Adelaide Casino on August 9, 2005, eight months after Steicke left his wife.

Just over a month later Gagliardi is believed to have sent a letter to Mary Thomson, who was based in the ATO’s complex compliance unit, and Glenn Smith, director of GST serious evasion. Gagliardi proposed that the ATO could have transactional records from TABs across the world, emails, international bank details and access to a former employee if it agreed to the deal.

He told the ATO he wanted – on behalf of his client who was married to one of the members of the Punters’ Club – a raft of things in return for her information.

A key part of the offer was a demand that the ATO levy a minimum penalty of 50 per cent on any tax liability including income, GST and capital gains. Half of any penalties recouped by the ATO would then be paid directly to Elisabeth.

The offer also proposed that the ATO share any further information it uncovered on Steicke to reimburse Elisabeth and Gagliardi’s costs and secure immunity from the police.

It is understood Elisabeth now disputes any involvement in approaching the ATO.

Smith responded the next day, asking for Steicke’s bank statements and details of trading done by Merrill Lynch.

CASE MOVED TO ATO’S SERIOUS NON-COMPLIANCE SECTION
The case was urgently moved to the serious non-compliance section of the Tax Office and the commissioner himself was to determine whether the offer was appropriate.

One day later, on September 16, 2005, a secret meeting took place with ATO officers Walter Vun and Peter Maxwell.

It is still not known what, if any, secret deal was hatched and whether a deed was agreed and signed. But it is clear from what has ensued in the courts that the ATO, which from January 1, 2006, was led by commissioner Michael D’Ascenzo, has used the documents in its possession.

Initially the ATO thought the investigation could involve tax evasion. Sources close to the club say that, for a period, the audit may have been within the ambit of Project Wickenby, a multi-agency tax evasion probe aimed at eradicating tax fraud.

TAX DEBT DROPPED FROM $1.86 BLN TO $541M

A source familiar with the case said the first figure floated by the ATO office for the tax debt was a monstrous $1.86 billion.

As the Punters’ Club audit was bounced from one division to another, no decision was made. An incredible 250 Tax Office employees worked on the club.

It was only late last year that the ATO began to issue assessments thought to total about $541 million, including interest and possibly penalties.

That was a big step down from $1.8 billion. The targets were Walsh, Ranogajec and the other Punters’ Club members. But no allegation of tax evasion was ever made publicly.

Walsh challenged the ATO assessment in the Federal Court in June and the case suddenly went public. The ATO accused Walsh and Ranogajec of hiding documents through encryption software, destroying business records and deliberately concealing management meetings.

The ATO alleged that the club, which turned over $2.4 billion in 2006 and similar figures for the years since, deliberately withheld information from the Tax Office to give the impression it pursued only recreational gambling.

WALSH DENIED ATO’S CLAIMS
Walsh, the only one of the group with a public profile he was prepared to exploit, vehemently denied the ATO’s claims and launched a media crusade to try to clear his name. Walsh suggested his beloved MONA in Hobart might have to close.

He told The Australian Financial Review at the time that the punters had always complied with the ATO’s requests, that any encrypted emails would have been handed over, and the watchdog had never even asked to interview him.

Then the Punters’ Club launched a related action in the NSW Supreme Court saying they believed the ATO had in its possession documents which had been stolen from the club and were privileged.

They wanted to know if the ATO had other privileged documents and for the court to say whether the documents could be used in legal proceedings.

The punters’ lawyers relied on a 114-page internal ATO report from 2007 titled: “Second report into the activities of the Punters’ Club by GST complex audit”. They had obtained the document as the result of a confidential hearing at the Administrative Appeals Tribunal.

The report was redacted to protect the ATOs confidential source but it explicitly made reference to “legal advice” given to the Punters’ Club.

ALARM BELLS NOT HEARD
The fact that the 2007 report made reference to “legal advice” should have sounded alarm bells for any employees with legal training.

Documents that are legally privileged cannot be deployed in a court and opponents do not even have the right to view them. Yet if any of the 250 ATO employees who worked on the case raised any concerns they were overruled.

At the first pre-trial hearing in the Federal Court both sides asked for time to try to settle the matter outside the public and prying eyes of the court. And settle they did.

Two weeks ago Ranogajec jetted in from London for several days of negotiations with the ATO. Walsh and legal representatives also attended.

SECRET SETTLEMENT NEGOTIATED
A secret deal was negotiated late on Thursday or early on Friday a week ago.

It is understood that the deal only relates to betting profits in Tasmania and South Australia and does not include other Australian jurisdictions or the vast betting that takes place overseas.

The settlement is inclusive of the years 2004-11. The Punters’ Club has been betting together as a loose group since about 1991.

Just why the ATO changed tack is unknown. Did it realise the evidence that had been promised was not true or simply inadmissible because it originated offshore? Or were divergent schools of thought within the ATO and the threat of another multi million-dollar stoush like that with Hogan making prosecution difficult?

While Steicke was not part of the secret settlement negotiations which began just under a fortnight ago and is still fighting the ATO, he might hope he can come to a similar agreement.

It was only in June this year that the ATO finally got around to issuing Steicke with a number of inflated assessments relating to his taxable income for several years. Six days later, it garnished the balance of his Australian betting account.

Some insiders are of the view that the settlement will pave the way for Steicke to negotiate a confidential settlement too.

While rationally it remains unclear whether the ATO will similarly back down with Steicke, there is at least a precedent which suggests they are open to negotiation.

It is the best birthday present he could ask for. His fellow punters were invited to celebrate with him, although it is thought Walsh declined. Even so, it is sure to be a party that won’t be forgotten.

Lapping up the world reserved for the rich and famous on the neon Macau strip, life for a now remarried Steicke is looking up, especially compared to his troubles of yesteryear.

(http://afr.com/rw/2009-2014/AFR/2012/10/26/Photos/3c116bf6-1f39-11e2-9582-90990977c913_27p48punters-RESIZED.png)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Dec-25, 11:17 AM
Bunch of Saturnalia Scrooges at the AFR not making this latest episode free.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/the_gambler_part_punters_club_rules_kRDFjvCVM3itMcRugyKr6M


 
What to do when you don’t want to pay the government
PUBLISHED: 21 DEC 2012 00:05:19 | UPDATED: 22 DEC 2012 00:33:01

The Punter’s Club, a profitable gambling syndicate, developed a strategy and prepared what is virtually an instruction manual to its members to guide them in how to respond to ATO queries.

It’s advice included to avoid giving information, asking for requests in writing and being vague in answers.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2012-Dec-28, 03:27 PM
RACECOURSE rumour has it that after mediation, mammoth punter Zeljko Ranogajec has reached a nine-figure settlement with the Taxation Office.

Ken Callander


How embarrassing must it be for Ken to pick up his wages for such tripe!

Is he trying to demonstrate that he knows less than anyone bar Max Presnell about our protagonist?

Couldn't he even check the jaundiced Wikipedia entry for the sum postulated there?


http://www.news.com.au/sport/superracing/sportingbet-market-mover-advertisement-on-tvn-a-boon-for-tab-turnover/story-fndpqu3p-1226542709145
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Gintara on 2012-Dec-29, 07:15 AM
From the above article and I know we have a dedicated thread but this is just plain tripe  :thumbsd:

MOST people in the racing game were happy to see the breeders have a win in court during the week in the artificial insemination case, which now sets in concrete a ban on AI in thoroughbreds in Australia and protects thousands of jobs.

If the verdict in the case had gone the other way it would not have made much difference to the racing game, with thousands of horses still available for purchase and thousands of horses still available to bet on, but it would have made a gigantic difference to the breeding industry.


There is no evidence that mass sacking would take place.  :no:  :stop:

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2013-Feb-14, 12:33 PM
Thought the whole article was good....must agree to differ...thanks for the post

The whole article was clearly not good because the delusional material about Zeljko made it that way.

Intentionally bad as Max may be, at least he has one thing over Ken.

In that Max actually dared to mention the taboo name of Ross Evans in the media.

Ken, by contrast, impersonates the 3 wise monkeys on that score.

Even though at the track he and Ross have been seen joined at the hip more often than Fletcher and Cunneen!

(http://www.law.uts.edu.au/multimedia/smgallery/30thParty/39.jpg)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2013-Apr-02, 05:36 AM
Extra names are something like:


Peter Bowen

Lisa Aitken

Tim Filby

Steve Atkinson

Alex Moore

John Reynolds

Rod Hyland

Zoe Davis

Martin Burns

Ron Firman


Martin Burns seems suspiciously like the now deceased guy Walsh is discussing he

http://monablog.net/category/david-walsh/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Authorized on 2013-Apr-02, 05:43 PM
You're an interesting character jfc.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2013-Apr-03, 11:27 AM
I thought I'd seen every article under the sun about the VITAB fraud, but this 2008 piece just popped up about Zeljko's masterstroke:

'In 1997, it emerged that Vanuatu betting agency VITAB, in which Mr Hawke had an 11 per cent shareholding, was involved in fraudulent dealings with ACTTAB.

An inquiry, set up by the ACT government, found Mr Hawke had had no knowledge of the deception and that his role was simply to appear at media promotions to "lend the venture respectability".'

So for both frauds Hawke is using the Sergeant Schultz defence.

The allegations in the latter case bring to mind those for Hawke's fellow student at the former elitist Perth Modern School - Rolf Harris CBE!

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/hawkes-partner-on-trial/story-e6frg6o6-1111117147693
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2013-Apr-03, 12:41 PM
You're an interesting character jfc.
I'm surprised that anyone would think I'd need encouragement.

But for the benefit of newcomers I stress that the key topics I pursue have great moment.

It is important for everyone in civilisation to know what Obama professed ignorance of. That Edison was (in home terminology) a douchebag!

And with Zeljko, defamation laws constrain me to credible references to matters on the public record.

But since nearly everyone here is a punter it should be clear that Zeljko's antics have damaged the caper and the industry to the point where it is literally what the acronym for former WA galloper Fubar represents.

The sooner Zeljko is brought to account and coerced to obey the laws the rest of us must follow, the better our civilisation will be.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2013-Apr-28, 05:33 PM
This might ring a bell with some of the bean counters presently employed at RWWA , Tabcorp and Tatts who currently offer rebates to the ilk of Zeljko and those former bean counters at Tote Tasmania before it was sold off to Tatts.

The following editorial was written in March 2013 by Joseph A. Faraldo, an attorney and president of the Standardbred Owners Association of New York, representing the over 1,000 owners, trainers and drivers regularly competing at Yonkers Raceway. He is a director and past chairman of the Board of the United States Trotting Association.
 
Faraldo told harnessracing.com that he wrote the following editorial because of his concerns that the increase in handle at the Meadowlands has not translated into an increase in purses, presumably because a "cartel" has been responsible for the additional wagering.  "My concern is people are going to be turned off and not bet on our game. My position is directed at anyone doing this in racing, not just the Meadowlands," said Faraldo. "I believe there also may be other tracks dealing with cartels. This concerns me that others will want to pay less than six percent for our signals."
 
Faraldo's editorial follows:
 
The "loss leader” is a concept that has been used in business forever. Basically, a product is offered at a price that generates no profit for the sake of generating increased activity. So, if you make a million dollars in sales, but your production costs are a million, you really haven't accomplished a whole heck of a lot.
It is only against this backdrop that one may appropriately consider the purported spike in handle at the New Meadowlands Racetrack. In this regard, there is a legitimate concern posed by the phenomenon referred to as "cartel wagering.”
The accommodation of the cartel at the New Meadowlands was recently exposed in an insightful Daily Racing Form article penned by Jay Bergman. Again, while everyone wants to see handle increase, the fundamental question that must be asked is at what cost?
The typical cartel represents a small group of sophisticated, moneyed players that have developed an elaborate, highly structured computer analysis handicapping and wagering system. The cartel then invests huge sums of money into track pools. Because of their level of investment, track management treats the cartel like an Advanced Deposit Wagering System. Unlike an ADW, however, the cartel doesn't take action from players like you or I; rather, it is the player.
Here's how it works. The track that wants to increase handle sells its signal to the cartel just like it was an ADW, but at a cheaper rate. Why? Well the cartel is expected or obligated to guarantee a certain level of play at a track. For example, let's say the cartel commits to $300,000 in wagers per night on New Meadowlands races. To entice that level of play, the track sells its signal to the cartel for one-third the usual rate. Thus, while the New Meadowlands sells its signal to everybody else at a premium of around six percent, the Cartel is charged only two percent. Other tracks and ADWs still pay the higher rates.
So, how does the reality of this loss leader play out? Simply, even if handle is tripled, since the price charged to those responsible for a large component of that handle is a thirdof what it "sells” to other bettors, both the track and horsemen are still in the same position economically. The addition of gross handle in this fashion produces a zero-sum effect, resulting in no additional revenue being generated to increase purses or add a race day. Sadly, it has done nothing for increasing on-track wagering heralded as a major accomplishment at the New Meadowlands. If the strategy has any positive ramification at all, it is that added handle generates more handle from other entities, like ADWs or other tracks whose rate was not lowered. Presumably, this bump in activity could at some point produce some increase in retained revenue for enhanced purses, but at the cost of other fellow racetracks, their horsemen and ADWs who pay the premium rate.
What does it all mean? Thanks to crackerjack computer software, coupled with the benefit of being afforded bargain basement pricing by the track, the cartel make a profit at the expense of the other bettors. Meanwhile, the New Meadowlands makes a little extra money, but nowhere near the benefit it should be realizing from what is daily touted as harness racing's largest handle. In effect, the high handle number is an illusion: Yes, there are a lot more dollars passing through the tote system, but very little of it produces a retained amount beneficial to the horsemen, the track or its investors who are played for more support. (Ring a bell with Tote Tassy ? )
The economic illusion serves as an excellent device to get more investors to contribute to track management.
It gets tiresome reading the daily pats on the back of growing handle because of all the smart things going on at the Meadowlands-- yet the truth is that there will be no additional race dates and no meaningful purse increases because, the truth be known, on-track handle is flat.
Then there is the potential for danger with these cartels. For example, an entity betting that $300,000 per card into pools via computer technology has the ability to manipulate those pools. A cartel certainly has the ability to, for example, create false favorites by pumping money into the win pool on an entrant/s in the first flashes of the tote board. It's even more dangerous if, like ADWs, it can later cancel those wagers. Other bettors will be influenced to follow the early money.
The DRF article did glimpse at this when it discussed some early favorites that didn't really figure from a handicapping point of view. Was this the cartel, the big fish, placing money on a horse, sucking in others to believe that there was a reason for making the no apparent form horse the choice?
Sound crazy? Well there have been instances at the New Meadowlands where at the start of a race three or four horses open up with large win bets in equal denominations-- $2,000 to win on different horses in a race-- which distorts and skews the pool odds significantly. While the cartel may not be at the root of the Saturday (Feb. 16) late double at the New Meadowlands, the $17 horse and a $56 horse combined for a mere payoff of $133.00 in a $32,000 pool. Results like this are quite hard to ignore, much less justify to the non-cartel type bettor.
The bottom line is that while a steadily increasing handle sure looks good, and maybe lures more investment money to management's pocket, it is not at all efficacious to the purse account. The cartel wagering entities come with risks that can produce more harm than good. The SOA of NY thought about dealing with cartels or, even worse, exchange wagering that NJ has authorized (where you can bet on a horse to lose). It's just too huge a risk to integrity, and makes the payoff a bad bet, both long and short term.



Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: whispering on 2013-Apr-28, 06:24 PM
jfc, im actually best friends with one of the cunneens, there are alot of sus things going on in that the family seem to win alot on the punt if u know what i mean. Cant really say much else as tipping isnt extended past the immediate family afaik but goulburn is a good place to start
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Jan-05, 01:37 PM
So now that the AFR is free till the end of the month, here's an opportunity to review some better quality journalism from Hannah and Angus.

As opposed to the recent garbage from the embarrassing duo I can't name, since the AFR has decided to clap out on me.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/the_gambler_part_punters_club_rules_kRDFjvCVM3itMcRugyKr6M

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Jan-06, 04:25 PM
Cute parochial article on Gatt and Steicke whom the AFR confirmed have split with the Z-team.

"While the divorce has been bitter, Adelaide legal and accounting firms have shared work generated by the case costing an estimated $36 million as at 2010 and running at an estimated $23,000 per sitting day since."

For a value punter like moi it seems incongruous to sacrifice that much moolah to shysters.

I'd find it challenging to spend 23 gorillas in a day at Stilleto.

http://indaily.com.au/business/2013/09/05/mega-punter-gets-lucky-again/
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: arthur on 2014-Jan-07, 01:22 PM
I'd find it challenging to spend 23 gorillas in a day at Stilleto.


One 'l' . . Two 't's'

Check it when next facing that challenge  :beer:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Jan-13, 08:01 AM
http://www.themercury.com.au/lifestyle/m-battery-point-penthouse-for-top-punter/story-fnj64ocs-1226799417665

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Mar-15, 06:45 AM
Maybe they just googled, Zelko -  axe to grind, and your name miraculously appeared.

While vainly checking out DCL's suggestion, I stumbled on this intriguing link:

http://www.ask.com/question/what-is-the-meaning-of-the-name-zeljko

And upon reading the highly ironic answer I nearly stumbled off my segway.

Certainly not what I'd always imagined.

I think this one is a bit closer:

http://www.behindthename.com/name/z18eljko

But still no cigar.

Anyone else care to have a stab?

I did have topical prize in mind for the best answer but after legal advice decided upon discretion.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Mar-25, 12:08 PM
Belated, but what a delicious demonstration of Channel 7's investigative jnournalism.

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/tv/costly-case-of-mistaken-identity/story-e6frfmyi-1226529877537
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2014-Apr-02, 04:14 AM
According to Alan Woods- Paul Makin 'persuaded' an employee to come over and work for him and bring across a version of the software. Paul Makin says 'he can't lose' on the USA races (similar track sizes, surfaces) he bets on. Of course the Woods, Zeljko analysis has the same origin but I believe Humbleton has progressed a lot more in recent years. So as far as I know Makin is US only.
All those cronies appear to be extremely persuasive when it suits them.

Beats me what's going on he

I recall rumours Zeljko was behind Typhoon Pools - which had that joke Tote in Norfolk Island.

Now Makin has another similar sounding outfit based in Sydney, with tentacles in Ireland, HK and San Francisco!

Talk about an ill wind.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/83934/typhoon-hub-commingling-with-hong-kong-pools

http://www.solocheck.ie/Irish-Company/Typhoon-Hub-Limited-533862#report-2

https://www.watchandwager.com/cms/About%20us
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2016-Jul-11, 09:54 PM
Interestingly Zeljko Ranogajec is the founder and main financial backer behind Colossusbets. This is the same company that has been exposed in Britain's biggest selling newspaper as offering a trillion to 1 bet. A complete marketing disaster as it also turns out that "brand ambassador" soccer player Michael Owen has a mortgage on his house with bookmaker Spreadex. No wonder if he thinks that a trillion to 1 bet is "extremely attractive"

Why is Zeljko Ranogajec pumping his millions into a company marketing the world's worst bet? Maybe he's mortal after all  :clap2:

https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/news/1123010/michael-owen-in-online-betting-row-with-the-odds-against-punters-at-a-trillion-to-one/

The patent for the world's worst bet was registered by one Bernard Marantelli who is the CEO of ColossusBets. 
http://patents.justia.com/patent/20160117888
The document confirms the trillion to one possibility of the bet along with confirming that tickets are seeded and swapped inplay.

Super salesman Marantelli has somehow persuaded super punter Zeljko that the worst bet in the history of the world is worth patenting.   :no1:

Of interest is that ColossusBets has partnered with Ladbrokes.au which means that an Australian licensee is offering a Zeljko pool.
http://calvinayre.com/2015/06/23/press-releases/ladbrokes-aus-launch-1000000-mega-margin-with-partial-cash-out/



(https://s9.postimg.org/424p8loej/Owen1.png) (https://postimg.org/image/424p8loej/)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2016-Oct-14, 04:38 AM
Here are some more links concerning Zeljko's achilles the hapless Bernard Marantelli. Marantelli is the son of Melbourne bookie Gavin and has been a professional punter for 20 years except for the decade that he spent doing covert PR (lying and threatening people to you and me) on behalf of those nice GMO people at Monsanto! So although no-one has ever met a bookie in England who thinks Bernard is a pro punter that's what he told Zeljko.  :o

Bernard's 2ic is now on the record as saying that the great man has been netted and is condemned to funding the multi million loss-making Colossusbets for the rest of eternity. Meanwhile at Newfield HQ in the Isle of Man some of the traders have left to pursue other interests... selling double glazing, gardening and pensions (this is actually true and not a joke). Then the great man goofed up on twitter and tried to justify his Betfair Premium Charge as fair play! https://twitter.com/PremiumCharged/status/782235311447371776

https://justpaste.it/Corporateblackmailer

https://jpst.it/ObQw

https://jpst.it/O6eu


(https://s22.postimg.org/3qw22s6od/oreilly_ZR4.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/3qw22s6od/)

(https://s13.postimg.org/en5306gib/ZRMsg1.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/en5306gib/)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2016-Oct-17, 08:04 AM
Seems like my Harmer's retreated to his Haven.

But apropos his claim that's a fake account, how come Betfair "consultant" The Badger seems to be twitterbating it?


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2016-Oct-17, 09:40 AM
The Stan Laurel character is Mr David O'Reilly who spent the majority of his working life as a corporate lawyer at Betfair. If anyone knows where the bets are buried he's our guy :thumbsup: David is now the Chief Operating Officer of ColossusBets. Dave's finest moment to date was when he gave the City of London police the runaround and this culminated with him having to admit at the Old Bailey race fixing trial that he had misled investigating officers.

"Will you now accept that the assertion in your statement is inaccurate and that in fact this was not a good example at all? In fact it is, regretfully, downright misleading," Kelson said.

"Yes, unintentionally so," conceded O'Reilly, as Kelson claimed that the Betfair data relating to eight of the 27 races had been "corrupted" by the inclusion of in-running bets.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2007/oct/12/horseracing

Now what is it that a man like O'Reilly might have told a Monsanto lobbyist type, such as Maranatell that would lead him to conclude that Bernard has Zeljko Ranogajec in his back pocket?  :shy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zTGOMqI83E
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2016-Oct-17, 11:50 PM

(https://s16.postimg.org/ss6chqh0h/ZRPC1.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/ss6chqh0h/)


Interestingly Zeljko's Colossusbets Chief Operating Officer it turns out has some interesting form for not being helpful to City of London Police officers investigating race fixing!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-uiK2z3QVw
(https://s24.postimg.org/m4pjmjce9/oreillydt.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/m4pjmjce9/)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2017-Jan-15, 11:36 AM
So if you ran your own betting pool and could purchase potentially winning tickets you would obviously go out of your way to give details of the original bettors in all publicity material. After all the fact that this ticket has enabled you to win all that rollover cash is something that requires everything to be above board. So despite many, many requests Colossusbets are no nearer to giving any clues at how the unlucky punter placed his bet. Usually third party agents of Colossusbets would be entitled to a share of the winning ticket, so in this case what price it's origin is close to home  :p :p :p

By an amazing coincidence this all happened around the time that Colossusbet's annual account filings showed that £10m of shareholders cash is long gone and they are now solely reliant on a £12m loan from the Royal Bank of Zeljko :clap2:

The thing about all this is if there was one person in the world you would want to ultimately control a betting pool in order to ensure that punters get what they richly deserve it's surely the conqueror of the Tassy Tote :stop:
(https://s27.postimg.org/7qkih8d3j/Capture1.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/7qkih8d3j/)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2017-Mar-10, 01:40 PM
Update on the Zeljko enterprise Colossusbets has appeared on @denis_mikan twitter handle. A link has been published which seems to link Zeljko to the tenniis courtsiding syndicate boss Steve High. Documents have appeared which show that Ragonajec's firm was doing a deal with a whistleblower who Betfair were threatening to sue :sad: Why would our hero want to silence the whistleblower and protect Betfair? :bulb:

Have a look for yourselves anyway https://justpaste.it/141t1

Colossusbets has a £10M shareholder deficit and is completely reliant on a £14M loan from it's major Tasmanian shareholder to be able to continue trading. :clap2:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Mar-22, 06:27 AM
This cause is right up Xenophon's alley.

Is this the time to impose a point of litigation levy?

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/law-order/elisabeth-steicke-branded-serial-litigant-by-judge-over-dispute-with-lawyers-connelly-and-co/news-story/7102d411ccf419af759a8f767121d286

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/law-order/adelaide-woman-involved-in-40-million-dispute-with-her-exhusband-one-worlds-biggest-gamblers-has-fired-her-law-firm/news-story/15fbec6c9b846b5918a19b6a8fc24ae2
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2017-Mar-22, 04:31 PM
This cause is right up Xenophon's alley.

Is this the time to impose a point of litigation levy?

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/law-order/elisabeth-steicke-branded-serial-litigant-by-judge-over-dispute-with-lawyers-connelly-and-co/news-story/7102d411ccf419af759a8f767121d286

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/law-order/adelaide-woman-involved-in-40-million-dispute-with-her-exhusband-one-worlds-biggest-gamblers-has-fired-her-law-firm/news-story/15fbec6c9b846b5918a19b6a8fc24ae2

After my punting efforts on today's Sandown meeting, I will never again be able to afford the digital subscription that those two links demand of me before I can view any Advertiser articles. This is a luxury for the rich  :sad:

But I gather this is one of those once in a blue moon occurrence where someone is very zealous in their legal pursuit of another - usually an ex-partner/spouse who has been an infidel - in the true sense of the word?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: ballybeg on 2017-Mar-22, 05:02 PM
PP7

Don't click the link - simply google - adelaide now steicke - and you will see the articles without any problems.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Apr-05, 09:13 AM
Some charming proclamations from our philanthropist.

Nice to see that his recent knighthood hasn't affected him.

Everyone is happy.


https://twitter.com/zeljkoranogajec/status/848248090259804165

https://twitter.com/zeljkoranogajec/status/848638037450006529

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: HarmersHaven on 2017-Apr-05, 11:12 AM
Do you really think it's actually ZR ???
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Apr-05, 11:26 AM
Do you really think it's actually ZR ???
Indubitably.

Or, in his words:


Once more you clearly demonstrate your inability to gauge your opponents.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: HarmersHaven on 2017-Apr-05, 12:22 PM
Well, that settles that then - thank you linesmen, thank you ball-boys.

Your eleven-word closing line has so many inaccuracies, it's Mair-like.

"Once more" suggests a pattern of behaviour/multiple occurrences, "you clearly demonstrate your inability" suggests that you actually think your screen-shot disproves anything and "your opponents" suggests that he is indeed that - he may be yours but that does not make him mine.

I asked a simple question which, given the online environment whereby trolls/aliases/fakes/pseudo-entities are more and more the norm than the outlier, came from a genuine place and indeed was a valid line of thought.

You just couldn't help yourself, you sad old man. 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2017-Apr-08, 12:08 AM
Was thinking of him this week.

Been working nights out at North Ryde as I often do this week - big network changes on after hours - even slept in the car one night  :shy:

Duck over to North Ryde RSL to have a break sometimes. Sit down with a coffee, watch some races and have a Keno ticket.

The 9 spot jackpot hadn't been won for a while and early in the week it was at $390k which is very high. So naturally I was taking 9 spot tickets.

Went to check my previous day's ticket on Wednesday night (I think) and noticed it had been won, and it had been won at North Ryde RSL!!!!

I think my hands were shaking a little as I checked my ticket.

Alas, God did not take up my offer to be a missionary if He could deliver on His part of the deal   :lol:

But what surprised me was that the jackpot went from high $300k's up to the winning jackpot of $606k very quickly.

I remember the syndicate having a crack at a big 10 spot jackpot in the past pushing it up rapidly and eventually winning some absurd amount, and from my recall they were operating out of North Ryde RSL.

Was wondering given the similarities in the modus operandi if it was them. Might have been sitting right next to the great man and didn't even know it  :what:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Apr-10, 07:58 AM
While it's hard to imagine any superior knee slapping hilarity than the last pair of posts, Zeljko is not known as someone prepared to be bested.

And inside protracted revelations yesterday, he's produced this gem of hilarity and mirth, to top the lot:


And I'm amazed that this has not been demolished.

Firstly Zeljko is on record as turning publicity on and off whenever it suits his aims.

He's chosen to make himself a public figure and has no right to object to truer accounts of his manicured image.

Then, it's amazing that the elected morons controlling this caper still haven't realised that there are two distinct predominant forms of legal gambling.

Player versus Bank

Player versus Player

When Zeljko finds a Casino stupid enough to offer him special deals on Blackjack, or whatever, then no other Players have any right to object, because it doesn't affect them. So Player versus Bank is fine.

But in Player versus Player scenarios anyone getting Kickbacks or other special treatment can exterminate even more skillful Players.

And not only are Players exterminated but so are the Totes and other outfits stupid enough to offer Kickbacks.

We've seen this with Tote Tasmania and others.

And we've seen this with Betfair where casualties such Rodent and Harmers Haven now look to lash out at others who have not (yet) met the same fate.





Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: HarmersHaven on 2017-Apr-10, 10:08 AM
Stick to the facts you sad, old man.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: mortdale on 2017-Apr-10, 10:47 AM
If you want to read what a court case back in 2012 heard, then click on the link below.

The content is far too long to submit on the forum.

It makes for interesting reading.

https://aussiecriminals.com.au/tag/zeljko-ranogajec/

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2017-May-10, 05:52 PM
Jfc, if this book is not snapped by yourself I will be disappointed

Losing Streak, by James Boyce..How Tasmania was gamed by the gambling industry.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-May-11, 05:38 AM
Looks like Boyce is merely one more hand puppet in Walsh's bizarre crusade to wreck pokies and thus force all the mugs into Keno where Zeljko can clean them all out.



http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-08/james-boyce-losing-streak-leads-to-bribery-allegations-review/8505818
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Sep-09, 11:29 AM
Evidently the Steicke vs Steicke saga is exceeding biblical proportions.

Surely David isn't competing in the Vatican Millions!

The massive legal expenses for this apparent exercise in futility, are reminscent of what we taxpayers paid racecourse identity and liquidator Max Donelly to chase Skase.

(http://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/e5d4b3b31058907fc64a9a849a28354d?width=650)

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/law-order/lawyer-owed-money-by-millionaire-gamblers-exwife-elisabeth-steicke-wants-her-stake-in-16-million-north-adelaide-villa/news-story/22c21701903f6142ea3a9284b62b2a93
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Entropy on 2017-Sep-13, 10:59 PM
Alas poor David!  he's actually not a bad bloke though I can see her viewpoint.

As for his Tasmanian name sake, his new found altruism makes more sense when correlated with Federals monopoly and the related desires of a gaming license and who knows perhaps one day Z will have his return on investment.
 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2017-Sep-27, 11:41 AM
What a colourful neighbourhood!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-4867112/Inside-Kyle-Sandilands-Imogen-s-4-000-week-Mosman-pad.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Feb-16, 07:15 PM
Oh dear.

Can't get Zeljko's name right yet.

Max clearly inhabits a different universe to mine in the 90's.

Anyway, another tale of audacity

Look to your laurels Fletcher!

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/racing/max-presnell-mystery-man-zjelko-back-on-the-radar-20180216-h0w71v.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Feb-18, 02:33 PM
If anyone has Archie's original article, please link/post it here.

I interpret this as -

Some official has allowed Zeljko data that other punters can't get. Similar to Stewards only tapes that Benter and Woods greased palms to get.

Besides parade ring data, fast pictures for in running bets would obviously be included.

Wonder who owns and operates this racecourse situated gear?

My bet is that these expert vets, trainers and jockeys don't jet over to the Isle of Man to do their stuff. So I wonder how much local tax is paid on these activities.

A significant amount of the betting would be through Asian Totes who pay zero to the local industry.

Competing punters would obviously find it tough, and consequently turnover from them would drop significantly.

Yes, Max, kickbacks to Zeljko should be disclosed. Along with a credible explanation how they cause any net benefits to the industry.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 09:29 AM
Revealed: ‘world’s biggest gambler’ is partner to new racecourse betting firm Britbet
Zeljko Ranogajec’s involvement raises questions over rival to The Tote

Mark Souster, Racing Writer
May 17 2018, 12:01am,
The Times

Ranogajec is known as the “Loch Ness Monster” as he is rarely sighted
Ranogajec is known as the “Loch Ness Monster” as he is rarely sighted
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An Australian businessman who has been described as the world’s biggest gambler is the controlling figure behind a company that will partner the new betting venture designed to support British racing, The Times can reveal.

Zeljko Ranogajec, a 56-year-old Tasmanian nicknamed the “Loch Ness Monster” because he is so rarely spotted, is one of two main shareholders in Colossus Bets, an online gambling company that is due to launch a new pool betting venture this summer in partnership with 55 UK racecourses.

The new service, called Britbet, is being set up as a rival to the Tote, which was privatised in 2011, and will have a visible presence at the vast majority of Britain’s 60 race tracks from July. It has been presented to gamblers and racing fans as a venture “by racing, for racing”, so that profits will be poured back into the sport.

An investigation by The Times into Ranogajec and Colossus Bets raises questions over whether Britbet chose the best partners to achieve that ambition of securing the deal which generates most revenue for the sport. Ranogajec is thought to have become a billionaire through his gambling prowess around the world using algorithms, sophisticated computer programmes and analytics. Much of his income is derived from the large rebates, often as high as 20 per cent on his bets, that he can command for playing into the betting pools.

“Pool betting” describes the type of betting markets in which all stakes are paid into a prize pot. The bookmaker then takes a percentage of that pot — meaning the bookmaker is guaranteed to make money — and the remainder is divided between all of the punters who placed winning bets.


Pool betting operators commonly offer rebates — where a percentage of a stake is repaid even for a losing bet — to large-scale punters prepared to bet huge sums of money, because they help to keep prize pots sufficiently valuable to be attractive to all gamblers.

When living in Australia, Ranogajec had twice before been able to negotiate legally high rebates with a betting operator in the Polynesian Islands and the Tote in his native Tasmania. The Tote there had to be sold off after it struggled to make a profit.

The Tote in Britain, the previously state-owned bookmaker that was sold to Betfred in 2011, has held exclusive rights to offer pool betting in the UK but that ends this summer, which is why most of the racecourses have established Britbet and plan to offer its service at on-course betting concessions from July.

Britbet announced last year that it had agreed a partnership with Colossus Bets, a London-based company founded in 2012, which would give them a platform to offer their pool betting products online. The Times can reveal today that in doing so, Britbet signed up to a partnership with Ranogajec.

During a 30-year gambling career, Ranogajec has, perfectly legitimately, made hundreds of millions of pounds in profits from horse racing by negotiating rebates of 10 per cent or more with the operators of pool betting services in other countries.

Once he has agreed the rebate, Ranogajec, who employs an army of analysts to identify the best bets, only needs to break even on his wagers and the rebate becomes his profit. If, as has been claimed, Ranogajec bets more than £500 million each year’ following this model would yield him a £50 million annual profit. While large-scale gamblers may be successful in pool betting, it can come at a price to the pool operator.

Ranogajec’s involvement in Colossus Bets — and its partnership with Britbet — will raise questions about the level of rebates the new service will offer, and whether those rebates will allow Britbet to put back into racing as much as it hoped. After an investigation by The Times into Colossus Bets, we can reveal that:

● Ranogajec also uses the name John Wilson. Wilson is his wife Shelley’s surname.

● Colossus Bets has not made a profit in six years, and accrued losses of £17 million over that period. It is only kept afloat by a short-term loan from Ranogajec and another shareholder.

● Ranogajec has been involved in two Tote pool operations in Australia, one of which in Tasmania had to be sold off by its government to stave off collapse.

● He has been the subject of a lengthy investigation in the Australian Tax Office (ATO), with whom he reached an undisclosed settlement in 2012.

● His address in London is a £14.8 million apartment at one of the capital’s most exclusive addresses in Knightsbridge.

● John Wilson is listed in Colossus Bets accounts as a person who has significant control over the business.

● His shareholding is held by an offshore trust in the Isle of Man.

Britbet is due to be rolled out on July 13, and racing fans will want to know whether it will offer high-value punters such as Ranogajec rebates for betting large sums. There has been speculation within the gambling industry that it may even offer rebates of more than 20 per cent.

Colossus Bets has two main shareholders, Ranogajec and Bernard Marantelli, who is listed as the chief executive. Between them they own more than 80 per cent of the company. Ranogajec, using the name Wilson, and Marantelli are listed as the company’s beneficial owners.

Colossus Bets’ most recent accounts, filed in December 2017, reveal that as well as making huge losses, it has a deficit in working capital of £15.2 million and is supported only by short-term loans of £18.7 million, which according to the accounts were due to be repaid by the end of March to its beneficial owners.

These loans had been long term but were reclassified last year, when the company borrowed another £5.2 million.

A decade ago, Ranogajec was the subject of a long inquiry in Australia, where the activities of a collection of high-level gamblers known as the Punters Club, which included Ranogajec, were investigated. They argued that gambling profits in Australia are not liable to taxation.

The ATO said that the club was not merely a group of friends but a highly organised business, betting vast sums which used sophisticated encryption technology to ensure privacy. As such it should be taxed.

When contacted by The Times, the ATO said: “We do not discuss individual cases.”

Once in Britain, Ranogajec and his wife Shelley — whom he met when she was working as a croupier in a casino — moved into One Hyde Park.

Britbet says that when it launches it will offer a range of “exotic and innovative bets” such as “cash out” and guaranteed six and seven-figure prize pools. It has also intimated that it will pay rebates and incentives.

Colossus Bets provides the backroom operation for Britbet through a company called Newfield in the tax haven of the Isle of Man. In its advertising it states that it is a company which specialises in “horse racing and sporting events”. Two of its directors are also directors of Colossus Bets and a trail leads back to Australia and to John Wilson.

Newfield also owns Newfield Australia, which is the holding company for a company called Data Processors. That company lists John Wilson as a director and sole shareholder, and gives his address in Britain.

Dick McIlwain, the former chief executive of Tatts Group, which runs pool betting services in Australia, said he was not surprised that Ranogajec had turned up in Britain. McIllwain rescued the Tasmanian Tote ten years ago after it struggled to recover from paying Ranogajec huge sums in rebates.

“He is so clever he will find some other jurisdiction he can come in through to get favourable rebates,” McIlwain said. “British racing needs to be aware he is not a charity.”

Colossus Bets did not respond when contacted by The Times for comment yesterday.

Full statement from Britbet
‘Colossus Bets provide innovative products, features and have a proven track-record in working with well-known brands.

“We undertook extensive due diligence on Colossus Bets, an award-winning company licensed by the UK Gambling Commission which provides betting products to a long list of licensed betting operators in the UK and overseas. We are obviously aware that Colossus benefits from Mr Ranogajec’s gambling industry experience and financial resources. We are also fully aware that his legal name is John Wilson.

“Incurring significant costs in seeking to establish a network business is quite normal and we are pleased to be partnering with an operator with the financial resources to pursue the ‘by racing, for racing’ Britbet vision of reinvigorating the pool betting landscape and securing revenues for the spo
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 09:39 AM
Zeljko Ranogajec revealed that he used the name John Wilson at a hearing in December 2008 at the federal magistrates’ court in Sydney. He was suing a former associate for A$2.5 million (about £1.4 million). When asked to state his name he replied: “My name is John Wilson and I am an investor.”

His answer then provided the detail that has led to The Times revealing his double identity — and his move into British racing.

He has a track record in Australia of legitimately making vast profits out of betting pool operations after boosting their turnover. It happened with a venture in the Polynesian Islands known as VITAB. The Sydney court heard in 2008 how Ranogajec had then focused on the United States and, with an initial outlay of A$200,000, earned A$50 million in three and a half years.

In the US, Ranojagec was being given a healthy 13 per cent rebate on all of his bets, according to court documents. He explained it to the court in simple terms: “You bet to lose so that you actually turn over more money and the win comes from the rebates. If you bet $100 and lost $5, but you get a 10 per cent rebate, you still make 5 per cent.”

Next stop was in his home state of Tasmania, where he was born in 1961, the son of Croatian immigrants. His prowess at counting cards in the casino at Hobart was renowned and led him to being promoted to the Blackjack Hall of Fame in 2011.

One man with first-hand knowledge of how Ranogajec works is Dick McIlwain, the former chief executive of the Tatts Group in Australia. In 2007 Ranogajec entered into an arrangement with the Tasmanian Tote. In just four years turnover tripled to almost A$1 billion, but the rebates, averaging 10.5 per cent, meant profits were scarce, down to just A$1.5 million in 2011. McIlwain bought the stricken government-backed Tasmanian Tote for A$103 million after it teetered on the edge of bankruptcy.

McIlwain told The Times: “If he is given a particular advantage over the recreational players, he will win more than anyone else. The pools will shrink over time as the recreational punters fall away. It is a bad outcome. It eventually strangles itself.”
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 03:22 PM
How comforting to learn over and over how legal Zeljko's operations are.

Meanwhile Kate McClymont aims for her 2nd Australian Racing Writer of the Year award, to bookend her 1995 Jockey Tapes one.
 

https://www.smh.com.au/national/meet-the-joker-the-australian-who-is-the-biggest-gambler-in-the-world-20180515-p4zfhi.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: turfdeli on 2018-May-17, 05:20 PM
How comforting to learn over and over how legal Zeljko's operations are.

Meanwhile Kate McClymont aims for her 2nd racing story of the year award.
 

https://www.smh.com.au/national/meet-the-joker-the-australian-who-is-the-biggest-gambler-in-the-world-20180515-p4zfhi.html

Its a really well researched and presented story - really impressive work and good to see the story finally out there in the mainstream.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 05:39 PM


Interesting twitterbating.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2018-May-17, 06:16 PM
Is that THE John Ibrahim that is quoted on twitter???
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 06:20 PM
Why don't you watch his feed to determine that, then tell us your conclusions?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 06:52 PM
“John Wilson” first appeared on corporate documents in December 1997.

Earlier that same month a board of inquiry had revealed that a privately-owned Vanuatu-based gambling company VITAB had “procured by fraud” a contract with the ACT’s TAB, which gave VITAB access to the Victorian TAB.

The damning report by Commissioner Richard Burbidge QC revealed that VITAB would never have passed probity checks because among its hidden owners were Australian gambling figures Peter Bartholomew and his brother-in-law Alan Tripp who had a string of criminal convictions for their gambling activities.

Former Prime Minister Bob Hawke owned 12 per cent and hidden via a Vanuatu-registered company controlled by a straw director were Zeljko and Walsh who owned 20 per cent.

Despite the commission’s best efforts to get Zeljko, Walsh, Tripp and Bartholomew to give evidence, they were nowhere to be found.

A summons was served on Zeljko’s and Walsh’s law firm which was run by now Federal Senator Eric Abetz and his partner Roger Curtis.

Mr Curtis told the inquiry that on September 10, 1997, the week before the commission’s summons arrived, Zeljko had collected the crucial VITAB file from Mr Curtis’ office. Mr Burbidge was furious. He said in his final report that the file removal was nothing more than an attempt to “handicap” and “frustrate” his inquiry.

The final report found there was not enough evidence to conclude that Hawke, Zeljko or Walsh were aware of the initial fraud when VITAB signed the contract with ACTTAB.



Must remember this strategy next time there's an enquiry into me.

Remove any incriminating files.

Be nowhere to be found.

Looks much easier than faking a car accident.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 07:44 PM
The Australian has picked up the Times story. Presumably Rupert owns both.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/news/australian-billionaire-zeljko-ranogajec-in-new-uk-betting-venture/news-story/0ec99dccbfc9d971c630b9a5d453d76e
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-17, 08:00 PM

This appears to be Zeljko's daughter.

Hopefully she'll enlighten all of us about pertinent facts.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-18, 07:45 AM
Emily seems to have inherited her twitterbating skills from pater.

After her bewildering attack about what appears to be in depth fact checking about an identity who goes to great lengths to defy fact checking, some cute rebuttals were seen, including-

That's what Eddie Obeid said, and-


Whereupon Emily blocks some users then belatedly protects her twitter feed.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-18, 09:42 AM
But, as he explained to the court, it wasn’t winning that kept them way ahead of the average punter – it was the rebates or "loyalty payments".

"It’s very simple," Zeljko told the court. "If you bet $100 and lost $5, but you get a 10 per cent rebate, you still make 5 per cent."

"You always win," he said. "I’m telling you that, if you bet very large, it’s a pari-mutuel pool, you depreciate it so far that you end up getting under fair odds. If you fix something at $8, you get six, but if you get a rebate that puts you into the positive."



An article that keeps on giving.

"Depreciate" is a cute euphemism for "manipulate".

Now if you force everything below fair odds, then no punter can win long term.

Unless they enjoy a compensating kickback!

Kind of Zeljko to reveal that gem while he's bankrupting his partner over discretionary kickbacks.

Now if that's happening with Tabcorp's Totes why is anybody without a kickback going near them!

When there are so many completely legal alternatives.

I invite you all to calculate what the kickback is if you get $6 about an $8 chance, and still end up in front!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2018-May-18, 01:58 PM
Why don't you watch his feed to determine that, then tell us your conclusions?

Probably because I don't use twitter or have an account.

Not everyone is a social media phile.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-18, 04:38 PM
Considering you don't need a twitter account to answer your question, it says little about your stature as a technophile.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2018-May-18, 06:10 PM
Considering you don't need a twitter account to answer your question, it says little about your stature as a technophile.

  :lol:

I have no intention of joining a social medium that appears to do nothing more than regurgitate narcissistic thought bubbles. And they don't pay any tax.

So is the John Ibrahim quoted above the John Ibrahim that has celebrity status?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-18, 06:20 PM
No one is asking you to join anything.

You are the one interested whether that John Ibrahim is Kyle's BFF, and you are capable of figuring that out for yourself.

I have other fish to fry.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Peter Mair on 2018-May-19, 07:06 AM


Stop the rebates on tote bets

................ one can only wonder what an inquiry into the racing industry would make of the policy that allows TABs to give rebates on bets into TAB tote pools.

These should stop.

....... are racing ministers aware of and happy with TAB punters being skinned in this way?

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-19, 07:30 AM
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40mrtimeform&src=typd

Not a lot of intelligent twit-twat around on Zeljko's Colossus of Rorts Rebates.

But influential(?) Phil Bull of Timeform seems to understand how insane the Brisbet initiative is.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-19, 08:07 AM

How can Brisbet fail with this gentleman at the helm?

https://twitter.com/BernardColossus/status/997593080562962432

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: bascoe on 2018-May-19, 06:02 PM

Stop the rebates on tote bets

................ one can only wonder what an inquiry into the racing industry would make of the policy that allows TABs to give rebates on bets into TAB tote pools.

These should stop.

....... are racing ministers aware of and happy with TAB punters being skinned in this way?
You are naive- ministers and the government know all about it - it was legislated and approved back in 2008 - when rebates began

This is no new story - rebates happen all around the world - they sent tastote bust- all tabs did pay rebates - and Tatts had it in a different form if you bet through a pool set up in Norfolk is gong back to 2003

Winning was easier before rebates but once they were in you had to chase them to stay financial due to the degradation of tote prices


Sent from my iPhone using Racehorse Talk (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90061)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Peter Mair on 2018-May-20, 04:03 AM


............the degregadion of the tote concept is understood ............ but now it is exposed it should be stopped.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-20, 08:38 AM
RWW pulls no punches in critiquing Kate's opus.

http://ausrace.com/pipermail/racing_ausrace.com/2018-May/000363.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2018-May-20, 08:49 AM
To play Devils advocate.

In all parts of society those that buy in bulk getter  a better price than  this that don’t.

For instance Coles and Woolworths pay significantly less for product than small retailers like IGA and other Independent stores for exactly the same item.

Betfair does exactly the same with commission rates. The biggest syndicate, has  been on 0 commission on Aust racing to provide liquidity since the day the “fair” opened.

Why no outcry re Betfair?

If I run the Tab why not charge less to the “wholesaler”  to guarantee liquidity in market. Rebates do mean that the syndicates bet bigger and pools are larger.

 I am not privy to the numbers, but rebates MAY mean Tabcorp make more money than if they didn’t offer them. Ie 3%  of triple is worth more than  7% of a single.

Lastly Tatts pools are so small they are close to terminal as no body can have a decent bet. Even 3 or $400 distorts pools in harness and greyhound. Rebates will mean that Tabcorp diminishing pools are held up due to the extra  turnover they attract.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-20, 09:29 AM
Any number of ways to rebut this.

Above I showed where Zeljko virtually confessed to "depreciating" markets - i.e. turning every Over into an Under. Because the generous Kickbacks more than suffice.

That means no one without a Kickback can win long-term on the Totes.

So all that competition is removed.

Imagine an intelligent small punter who does his homework and manages to win (or come real close).

The money may not be his main reward. The prestige gained from outdoing his mates at work or the club is paramount.

While he keeps having winning days, he'll keep punting. As will his mates keen to match his record.

But now he inevitably finds himself losing, and he'll find something more fulfilling to play like Sports betting or Poker tournaments.

Whereupon Tabcorp has lost 40 years revenue from him and his mates.

This is hardly a theory, you can see the effects in Tabcorp's KPIs.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Antitab# on 2018-May-20, 11:22 AM
You are so obsessed with Zjelko you are missing the point.

After rounding TAB take out is close to 117% win. I am prepared to say no one wins at SP at a rate to make a profit  betting into that pool.  So I agree , you can’t win without rebates.

Tabcorp are running a business , they have identified for the reasons in my prior post that Pari mutual is more profitable for them if they attract wholesalers investing by offering rebates . 

Zjelko, other syndicates and also individuals are in the fortunate position where they bet  at a scale to take advantage of these rebates. Similar to Betfair these rebates increase as the entities turnover increase.

Its well advertised , not corrupt, it happens in every industry in  the world and as I said also happens at Betfair which. I never see any complaints about.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Peter Mair on 2018-May-20, 03:53 PM


............... the idea that rebates on tote betting are adding to liquidity is a nonsense.

Before the jump the only liquidity in the market is the Tote pool and the syndicates are subsidized with rebates to knock it off.

That is not the proper policy for a tote betting operation --all should pay the same % freight.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-20, 04:02 PM
That might actually be true!

However I've set up a new thread fro the Rebate Debate so how about joining in with any rational contributions there?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2018-May-26, 06:43 PM
You are so obsessed with Zjelko you are missing the point.

After rounding TAB take out is close to 117% win. I am prepared to say no one wins at SP at a rate to make a profit  betting into that pool.  So I agree , you can’t win without rebates.

Tabcorp are running a business , they have identified for the reasons in my prior post that Pari mutual is more profitable for them if they attract wholesalers investing by offering rebates . 

Zjelko, other syndicates and also individuals are in the fortunate position where they bet  at a scale to take advantage of these rebates. Similar to Betfair these rebates increase as the entities turnover increase.

Its well advertised , not corrupt, it happens in every industry in  the world and as I said also happens at Betfair which. I never see any complaints about.

I agree with Antitab.

It goes on every day in business around the world.

People get discounts if they buy in bulk. The merchant reduces his or her margin per unit and works out the net profit they make, and consider the alternative (and the risk) of insisting on the existing per unit margin and missing out on the business.

It is not corrupt and is a legitimate agreement between two parties. In this case Zeljko (and other rebate recipients) and TABCorp shareholders.

The only rebate operation I have a problem with is where they bet big into place pools to the point that their true dividend is less than a dollar, and to meet legislative obligations tabs are allowed to steal from the payout pool of the other placegetters to raise the dividend of the placing that the big better has hit. This was going on for a while under a model where the NSW TAB had to pay $1.04 minimum - now reduced to $1.00. Not sure if it still goes on but it should be outlawed if it does.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-26, 07:05 PM
Corruption goes on everywhere every day.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: JWesleyHarding on 2018-May-26, 07:34 PM


.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Peter Mair on 2018-May-27, 07:33 PM

Any properly convened inquiry into the fair operation of totes would decry rebates.

The idea that rebates are 'paid' by Tabcorp shareholders is complete and utter.

The plundering of the pools by syndicates, effectively having free bets, is completely contrary to the concept of a pari-mutuel pool.

One thing that astounds me is that Tabcorp  itself does not operate a syndicate to rort the pools.

The management and conduct of the Australian racing industry is dedicated to dealing unfairly with most punters.

The only real tote customers are treated as mugs best deprived of their total betting budget as quickly as possible.

 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: stiffarm on 2018-May-27, 07:50 PM
https://magician.co.im//#Home

Another Zeljko company?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-May-28, 08:19 AM
Here is Zeljko's NYRA bid.

Talk about an ensemble cast!

O'Farrell is of course the partner that Zeljko bankrupted.

Schreck who killed off the Waterhouses, eulogised and facilitated Alan Woods in HK. And as NSW Chief Steward was supposed to be keeping Zeljko under control.

Zeljko was subjected to an integrity check. But the shamus was unable to find one syllable about the VITAB fraud!

And if too much colour is not enough-

"It may not help that the Governor of New York, Elliot Spitzer, who is initially to assess the proposals, is the same man who as state Attorney-General levelled charges against NYRA officials for allowing overweight jockeys to ride at all three tracks."

http://www.news.com.au/finance/aussie-in-new-york-racing-bid/news-story/c058f71ba4cbda104e94aab1edc6222b

https://www.theage.com.au/news/national/taking-a-whip-to-new-york/2007/08/04/1185648212987.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: bascoe on 2018-May-28, 11:16 PM
And in a move that may be viewed as the shape of things to come - OTB - (off course betting) in New York City closed down in 2010.  Still available in New York state though in other cities.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Jun-07, 12:42 PM
Make of this what you will.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: HarmersHaven on 2018-Jun-07, 08:38 PM
I questioned the legitimacy of this Twitter account moons ago and this line of thinking was howled down by His Highness in his inimitable holier-than-thou fashion.

My thoughts were backed up by somebody who would know/has weekly contact with the bloke - as opposed to somebody who is infatuated with/stalks said individual.

Would love to be proven wrong though.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Peter Mair on 2018-Jun-07, 08:42 PM


..........just look in the racing cot and confiscate the toys he plays with
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: LeRoi on 2018-Jun-07, 09:41 PM
Make of this what you will.

<blockquote class=\"twitter-tweet\" data-lang=\"en\"><p lang=\"en\" dir=\"ltr\">In the shadows no more.</p>— Zeljko Ranogajec (@zeljkoranogajec) <a href=\"https://twitter.com/zeljkoranogajec/status/1003822120634216448?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw\">June 5, 2018[/url]
<script async src=\"https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js\" charset=\"utf-8\"></script>

What I make from it is that is definitely not him. And it was hilarious Kate McClymont thought it was.


Sent from my iPhone using Racehorse Talk (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90061)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Jun-08, 07:08 AM
Indubitably.

Or, in his words:


Once more you clearly demonstrate your inability to gauge your opponents.

What part of "indubitably" eludes some of you?
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2018-Jun-08, 05:50 PM
Could this come to be ? At least 'our" ABC believes so

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-08/david-walsh-statue-with-tribute-plaque---artist-impression.jpg/9846190
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Jun-10, 09:47 AM

https://www.betfair.com.au/hub/better-betting/customer-insights/the-actuary/

Zeljko's feathers appear ruffled in this intriguing exchange.

Many might consider the article in question as a ripping yarn.

If I enjoyed an edge over my opponents I'd try to keep my trap shut.

And If I was losing out to them I'd also keep quiet. And try to work out what I was doing wrong.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2018-Jun-10, 07:23 PM
I questioned the legitimacy of this Twitter account moons ago and this line of thinking was howled down by His Highness in his inimitable holier-than-thou fashion.

My thoughts were backed up by somebody who would know/has weekly contact with the bloke - as opposed to somebody who is infatuated with/stalks said individual.

Would love to be proven wrong though.

Surely that is not him.......
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: turfdeli on 2018-Jun-10, 11:03 PM
Agree that was the only thing I didn't believe about that story, that the super reclusive genuis would have a Twitter account with his real name and showing an expensive car...
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Jul-04, 05:37 PM
Suppose we should at least be grateful Bubba didn't start a new thread.

Anyway there are some curious things about that photo.

Kirsha appears to be very, very small.

And Zeljko appears to have experienced a belated growth spurt.

Note how the guy on his right is not sitting, but squatting.

Also, I have this suspicion that this apparent expose is actually another arrangement as part of a Zeljko charm offensive to snow those involved with the UK Tote.

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/newpix/2018/06/28/02/4DAB0FDE00000578-5885445-A_rare_photo_of_the_man_widely_believed_to_be_the_world_s_bigges-a-1_1530148242757.jpg)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2018-Dec-31, 12:55 PM
An unflattering twitter review of the Colossusbets' numbers.

Cumulative losses of GBP 20 million are not a good look.

Nothing about Kickbacks to Zeljko. They are probably buried in the Cost of Sales bucket.

However there is one fascinating revelation.

Rest of World revenue grew 2 million to nearly double.

But the UK dropped by around the same from 11 million!

That seems to be a very serious situation. It seems the UK punters are voting with their feet. Once revenue drops for such outfits it is almost impossible to ever trend back up.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Apr-21, 07:21 AM
The video has been challenged for copyright by Zeljko's man servant Bernie Marantelli on Twitter, so here it is on Vimeo :tin:

https://vimeo.com/328933368?ref=tw-share

In other news Colossusbets punters have become increasingly aware of how any decent rollovers keep being improbably shared and therefore diluted. Well a recent change to the company's Terms And Conditions contains this nugget


(https://i.postimg.cc/WhB7BCgg/CBT-C.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/WhB7BCgg)

Basically this covers Zeljko so he can bet into his own pools. The UK Gambling Commission as usual asleep on the job. Whether or not the American regulators will do the same is altogether another matter!
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Jun-21, 08:05 AM
"Zeljko Ranogajec has been part of David Walsh's gambling syndicate that began operating in the 1980s."

Have to love informed investigative journalism.

The mind boggles as to how long a Walsh led syndicate would last.

https://www.afr.com/rich-list/rich-list-boasts-record-number-of-debutantes-20190529-p51se0
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Jul-01, 08:35 AM

(https://i.postimg.cc/PpSR7NLZ/BMCheat1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PpSR7NLZ)

Man running a Zeljko corporation tweets that he has no need to "cheat" because said corporation is worth "100s of millions". Said corporation is officially insolvent with a negative net worth of £19M. Meanwhile all the rollovers keep vanishing off punter's screens and no-one has any idea who is "winning" them. Definitely worth following this particular account because it is beginning to look like Mr Ranogajec's man has lost the plot  :lol:
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Jul-01, 09:16 AM
Hopefully you can get the whole thread below.

Everybody bar Zeljko betting into a blind pool.

Nothing to see here.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Jul-05, 08:43 PM
https://twitter.com/BernardColossus/status/1112619559155126272

Zeljko's man now claiming that he lobbied against FOBT machines alongside Salvation Army and the Church whilst at the same time launching this charitable effort https://calvinayre.com/2015/09/25/press-releases/colossus-bets-and-core-gaming-launch-partial-cash-out-slot-with-sky-vegas/

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Jul-16, 09:44 PM
https://twitter.com/MrTimeform/status/1149977157260718087

Why has Zeljko now got an overdraft for his company? :wacko: Also it looks like there are personal guarantees involved as technically Colossusbets Limited is insolvent :thumbsd:

Why would a billionaire need to mortgage his bank account. Has David Walsh spent all the money on MONA :chin:


(https://i.postimg.cc/cvc5F97J/PSC1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/cvc5F97J)

(https://i.postimg.cc/5H7KVXRd/PSC2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/5H7KVXRd)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Aug-18, 10:21 PM
Billionaire Zeljko seems to be funding a bunch of social media nincompoops in order to promote his failing Colossusbets. His hapless stooge Bernard Marantelli stumbles from one disaster to another. His latest wheeze being to alienate most of the British greyhound racing community by refusing to pay the voluntary levy, Worth watching his feed @Bernardcolossus for daily fails :p

https://player.vimeo.com/video/354198386
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2019-Aug-21, 10:23 AM
Anyone had a go at the "Betting and Data Analysis exercises" shown in the Sports-betting quantitative analyst position for Magician? (link below)

Have had a crack; used Excel not the statistical languages; an interesting test, not sure if the data set is from a real set of race results and uses their real calculated "win fair price"?

https://magician.co.im//Home#Careers
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B8A-r_oAvzc0Vm9mbzNGUDBOQnM
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Aug-21, 01:05 PM
Too busy with my own modelling to attempt those exercises right now but they look fairly basic, compared to the advanced modelling needed to win these days.

It certainly walks and quacks like one of Zeljko's outfits.

Wonder why his existing 300 Quants aren't up to it.

You'd have to be extremely naive to consider applying.

There seems to be a lot of dead wood there and it would be very depressing busting your hump then watching the fruits of your hard work squandered away on porn museums and incessant first class travel by your demanding taskmasters.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2019-Aug-21, 05:10 PM
Data is your porn JFC, worth having a look if it is a real data-set and it only took fifteen minutes to complete and analyse in Excel.

The Win SP market percent varies around 100% but averages overall 100.00% which might indicate it is fictitious, surprisingly to me the advantage is only tiny if my calcs are correct?

74,249 bets greater than $2 and all the profit from these is wiped out by just 25 Lay bets where their "win fair price (WFP)" is calculated to be less than or equal to $1.25; after capping the max lay to the bank of $10k.

Convert any Lay bets where their WFP is less than $1.25 to a Back bet and the "project" improves considerably.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Aug-22, 07:10 AM

74,249 bets greater than $2 and all the profit from these is wiped out by just 25 Lay bets where their "win fair price (WFP)" is calculated to be less than or equal to $1.25; after capping the max lay to the bank of $10k.

Laying a contingency is equivalent to Backing its complement.

By my calculations, for Fair Prices <= $1.25 the Kelly Fraction will always be below 20% - or $2,000.

So why the capping?

If anyone disagrees show us your calculations and I'll show you mine.

Incidentally the more I look at the exercises the more absurd it seems.


Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2019-Aug-22, 12:25 PM
I have these three capped at their $10k bank?


win_fair_price   win_starting_price
1.082              1.022
1.08                      1.03
1.124                  1.046

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Aug-22, 04:17 PM
Here's my workout for the 1st one.

1.0819 Fair Price
1.0219 SP

Laying that is equivalent to Backing the Complement.

13.2100 Fair Price Complement
46.6621 SP Complement

5.545800% Kelly Fraction
$554.58 Stake
$25,323.28 Net Winnings

So $25,323.28 is the required Lay Stake.

So you are correct about capping.

My Kelly Fraction was correct, but I was wrong in not realising that the Back Winnings (hence Lay Stake) could exceed the Bank.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Grega9430 on 2019-Aug-22, 06:16 PM
Copy, this "project" still blows the net winnings (before 5% commission) from 74,249 bets on the 25 Lay bets at WFP less than 1.25, as 24 of these won.

It only needed one of these bigger lay bets (Winx) to get beat at $1.10 to correct that plus some, a lot hinging on one result.

16% their maximum overs seems light, but again not sure if dataset is real.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Sep-06, 05:50 AM
Zeljko hitting new lows with the success of his Guaranteed Jackpot greyhound betting pools


https://twitter.com/MrTimeform/status/1169679511107117056?s=20
(https://i.postimg.cc/68NDZ2P5/CB30-K050919.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/68NDZ2P5)
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2019-Oct-02, 09:47 AM
I see in The Financial Review Zeljko is listed as the 164th richest Australian with assets of $600,000,000. Probably a bit of a guesstimate there, as unlike many others in that top 200 rich list, whose  holdings are listed in public companies,to my knowledge, Zeljko's assets are not on any public register.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Oct-03, 02:34 AM
It seems that Zeljko has gone out of his way to drop hints about his wealth and the scale of his betting. What is fact is that he has effectively hobbled his corporation Colossusbets Ltd by withdrawing less than $10M from that company's balance sheet. This has seriously disadvantaged the business which is already technically insolvent. So if he is worth thereabouts of $600M why would he do that?

In other news his corporate mouthpiece Bernard Marantelli the former Monsanto PR man, has suddenly deactivated his @BernardColossus twitter handle :wavecry: In a way you cannot really blame Bernie as his recently launched greyhound betting pools are now a contender for the worst betting product of all time :beer: 50,000 GBP guaranteed jackpots regularly having less than fifty or so tickets bet into them.

(https://i.postimg.cc/F7B54K60/CB30-K050919.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/F7B54K60)

(https://i.postimg.cc/94bFy7bs/Greyhounds30-K.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/94bFy7bs),

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: fours on 2019-Oct-03, 11:23 AM
Limiting losses is the normal reason of a sane man.

Fours
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Tracksuitdave on 2019-Oct-03, 07:37 PM
I agree that's what seems to be happening at Colossusbets.

Zeljko Ranogajec and team also lost multi millons backing the ill fated WBX exchange. He now has the Colossusbets cash burner on his hands and an interest in lossmaking Matchbook. No doubt that the man is a very good punter but as a proprietor of betting companies he is a big time loser. Ranogajec also has to share his spoils with Mr Walsh and the money pit that is MONA! Interesting scenarios all round.

I wonder if the beleaguered Bernard Marantelli ends up suffering the same fate as Zeljko pawn Karl O'Farrel whose reward for failure was to be bankrupted by the the great man.

One further point of interest is that Zeljko is also involved in claiming to have invented "cashout" along with Mr Marantelli. On the face of this is an astounding claim and they have registered patents. The amusing part of it that they filed their patents half a decade after another inventor claimed the same rights!  Zeljko - industry visionary or patent troll :shy:

https://www.legalsportsreport.com/26503/cash-out-patent-claim-irish-company/
https://www.intergameonline.com/igaming/news/bet365-targets-us-market-with-colossus-bets-cash-out
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: Bubbasmith on 2019-Oct-04, 04:14 PM
I agree that's what seems to be happening at Colossusbets.

Zeljko Ranogajec and team also lost multi millons backing the ill fated WBX exchange. He now has the Colossusbets cash burner on his hands and an interest in lossmaking Matchbook. No doubt that the man is a very good punter but as a proprietor of betting companies he is a big time loser. Ranogajec also has to share his spoils with Mr Walsh and the money pit that is MONA! Interesting scenarios all round.


Unlike other mere mortals, who punt to win to survive, Zeljko has admitted he does not punt to win but bets to survive on rebates. In reality,he is most likely a no better punter than the smartest of those mere mortals, but has exploited the fools that have offered him rebates from his early days in Tasmania to the present day.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Oct-06, 12:31 PM
Copy, this "project" still blows the net winnings (before 5% commission) from 74,249 bets on the 25 Lay bets at WFP less than 1.25, as 24 of these won.

It only needed one of these bigger lay bets (Winx) to get beat at $1.10 to correct that plus some, a lot hinging on one result.

16% their maximum overs seems light, but again not sure if dataset is real.
Although I haven't wasted any time analysing this, I can't get it out of my mind so maybe this post will bring some closure.

First, there is a major blunder in not realising that there is NO minimum Stake for SP, but minimum Liability.

Big, big difference. And what sort of  hotshot is anyone who could be so ignorant!

Next, the exercise is completely wrong.

While every punter should understand the Kelly Criterion, I doubt there is any situation in real life where it can be applied directly.

Moreover adding Kelly Fractions within the same contest is mathematically wrong.

Consider a fair regular tetrahedron with implied True Odds of $4.

But you are offered

A $6
B $6
C $3
D $3

The Kelly Fractions are.

A 10%
B 10%
C 0
D 0


But staking 10% on both is wrong.

Because obviously this opportunity is equivalent to being offered $3 about 1 face of a fair coin.

Where the Kelly Fraction is 25%!

But don't get me started.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: stiffarm on 2019-Oct-07, 03:40 PM
This is not a bad approximation: http://angrystatistician.blogspot.com/2018/04/simplified-multinomial-kelly.html
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Oct-08, 03:55 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion#Multiple_outcomes

That blog contains a broken link.

The fix is above.

Why did they make it so convoluted!

Seems to me the only inputs needed are-

Want = True Odds
Have = Best Odds on Offer

Consider only favourable bets - where Have > Want

The KF for any single bet

=(Have/Want-1)/(Have-1)

For all favourable bets-

RS
=(1-COUNT(Want)/HARMEAN(Want))/(1-COUNT(Have)/HARMEAN(Have))

The combined KF for each bet is

=1/Want-RS/Have

A simple spreadsheet which actually works for my earlier example where Want=4 and Have=6.

I trust Zeljko's 300 Quants will find this useful.

Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: The Yank on 2019-Oct-10, 05:35 AM
Unlike other mere mortals, who punt to win to survive, Zeljko has admitted he does not punt to win but bets to survive on rebates. In reality,he is most likely a no better punter than the smartest of those mere mortals, but has exploited the fools that have offered him rebates from his early days in Tasmania to the present day.

His wagering models are very strong.  Most computer teams lose money straight up and show their profit from rebates.  The pools worldwide are too efficient to make money betting large sums without the rebates.

I have no ties to the man and only spoke with him once years ago but know some of his associates well. 
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2019-Oct-24, 06:10 AM
Keno 9 spot jackpot started rising quickly the other day and went off at $450,000.

And guess where the winning ticket was sold - North Ryde RSL - surprise, surprise.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Nov-09, 07:58 AM
Cute article about an attempted Keno Jackpot raid.

Reminding all that Bernard Marantelli, the perp in question, is/was Australian.

Until recently he was Zeljko's gofer heading up ColossusBets a licensed Corporate offering PotofGold Jackpots for plebs, and undisclosed potential special advantages for Zeljko.

Formerly a Twitterati he has recently mysteriously vanished.

Whether this Keno gambit was on behalf of Zeljko or as a rival is not known, at least to me.

https://www.bakersfield.com/ap/national/how-british-professional-gambler-took-aim-at-m-lotto-jackpot/article_478a358d-6572-5f82-ae37-26dba99333ad.html?utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=user-share
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: PoisonPen7 on 2019-Nov-09, 10:35 AM
Keno 10 spot jackpot has risen to $2.6 million and the "bonus jackpot" ($2 per game) is at $5.87 million.

Not sure if they are big enough to be in play yet.

The expected payout for a 10 spot keno is $0.65 if the jackpot is $1 million. So they have to make up $0.35 through the jackpot before the value is there.

Hits Probability  Payout   Expected Payout 
0 4.5791%  $                                 -    $                            -  
1 17.9571%  $                                 -    $                            -  
2 29.5257%  $                                 -    $                            -  
3 26.7402%  $                                 -    $                            -  
4 14.7319%  $                             1.00  $                    0.1473
5 5.1428%  $                             2.00  $                    0.1029
6 1.1479%  $                             6.00  $                    0.0689
7 0.1611%  $                           50.00  $                    0.0806
8 0.0135%  $                         580.00  $                    0.0785
9 0.0006%  $                    10,000.00  $                    0.0612
10 0.00001122%  $               1,000,000.00  $                    0.1122

100.00%
 $                    0.6516

Whenever the winning ticket is sold at North Ryde RSL (which it always seems to be when a big jackpot goes off) I assume it is Zeljko and team. No evidence for that apart from a story written a long time ago - might have been posted on this forum - that mentioned something along those lines.
Title: Zeljko Exposed
Post by: jfc on 2019-Nov-09, 10:56 AM
I calculate $4,105,555 is the Jackpot required for fair value.

But if you're on a 10% Kickback it's a mere $3,213,942.

When they launch into action  the Keno page will be palpable.

Note how the Connecticut Lottery Corp denied the perps special treatment.

In stark contrast to officers here.

And contrary to Bubba's observation that said officers retire to idyllic islands, I note that those here eventually resign to accept sinecures with the perps!